The Crypto Married People

I went for a sort of a hike with a Quadruple Sagittarius Business Whiz on the weekend and among other subjects, we discussed The Crypto-Married People. It’s not only a thing, it seems that every large city has a (leafy, suburban, middle class) region where they congregate.  So this dialogue occurred because i mentioned a Virgo gentleman who was interested in me – compliments, an actual date proposed and all. I know. Like a relic from the 20th Century.

Anyway, i looked at his socials and voila the wifey. Upon asking him about this person and whether or not he thought this could have an impact on his dating intentions, he said “I don’t really see myself as married.” Okay, well i don’t really see myself as single. I am actually in an ‘arrangement’ with Christian Bale, having met when he sought me out for my views on Saturn, Pluto and the psyche of Bruce Wayne.  Seriously, is not really seeing yourself as married a version of L.O.A.?

Then i blamed my Venus-Neptune trine – again – for having attracted this sort of loopy vibe in. But no, says Quadruple Sagittarius Business Whiz, he is just “crypto married” as are probably a third of the people in any area repeatedly described in the media as “leafy” or “aspirational.”  She thinks it is to do with global asset bubbles and people not wanting to actually officially split assets, change weekend routines or disturb any stagnant waters of their psyche.

Will Pluto in Aquarius and robots for everything change any of this? Have you ever been or ARE you crypto-married? Thoughts?

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amazonalison
amazonalison

Ahhhhh, Neptune. With it on the Ascendant and SN, I attract addicts and depressive types. Dating is so tricky when you have it strong!

Jokerman
Jokerman

That’s a heck of a birthmark AA.

Pi
Pi

You were a respected shaman who has returned to become one of The People?

Scorpy
Scorpy

That last line! Gold!!!

sphinx
sphinx

I never thought about marriage and wasn’t amazed at the prospect when asked. But doing it really surprised me! My Venus/Saturn/Mercury conjunction really appreciated 1. adorning the sentiment with 2. traditional ritual and 3. verbally asserting our combined intent. It changed the relationship like when you streamline a vehicle for speed. If that makes sense.

So crypto marriage is just a liar lying with a more up to date excuses. Who isn’t appreciative, grateful or happy & has set no intent on becoming so. Hungry ghosts eating off the plastic fruit plate.

Starbaies
Starbaies

Really loved both paragraphs, especially the last bit.

Pi
Pi

ah, the hungry ghosts. indeed.

ragazza
ragazza

Does the wife know she is only crypto-married? I suspect not.

Della c C
Della c C

you had me at Christian Bale!

Tauroscorp
Tauroscorp

My thoughts? Some people are just f**king idiots.

Moonglow
Moonglow

I think this is just an encounter with a run of the mill, dime a dozen, deceitful narcissistic douchebag. They’re possibly just proliferating due to internet pornography giving them the idea that they are sex gods and women are trash…

Tauroscorp
Tauroscorp

Agreed. No need to dig any further!

flowerchild
flowerchild

Boom. This. Perfectly and succinctly stated!

Starbaies
Starbaies

Agreed! Was reminding me of my ex and avoiding commenting on the thread… but this sums it up nicely.

sphinx
sphinx

Yes – rose by any other name.. he’s just couched in leftist ideologue type language.

Pi
Pi

sometimes it helps to under-think things 🙂

Cat
Cat

I’d say going through the dark waters of the psyche is likely it. My sense is that it is likely to start with two people who are unwilling to go through those waters and evolve together. It may be easier for them to disconnect and ‘start again’ with different relationships. I can see how these people may avoide change. Or maybe ot is a ‘stay together for the kids’ stereotype. So much to consider with crypto relationships. Thankfully I don’t know first hand. I find it interesting to see stereotypes pop up in the comments…. particularly married women or women… Read more »

Melodryad
Melodryad

Ah, Mystic! I suspected you had a Venus trine Neptune on the poetic merit of your writing alone. I am not familiar with any crypto-married people. I do know a few people who serially attempt open relationships when they are too possessive to be constitutionally suited (hence the serial). For whatever reason, I’ve always lived in a parallel universe where the men are more into commitment than the women. Perhaps because I have a Mars Sun conjunction, I find it extremely easy to relate to men. I have always had more male friends than female friends, and they confide in… Read more »

Alouetta
Alouetta

Hey thanks for this. Lots of that makes sense to me. I’m really glad you two found each other, though it does sound like you have created this excellent situation yourself by having a generous and discerning heart. One thing though that confuses me though: how do you know if the other person is genuinely good and you are making them act out their lower selves by the way you treat them, or if the other person is ‘problematically flawed’?

milleunanotte
milleunanotte

You aren’t making anyone do anything. You can only keep being you, and the other person will respond with their lowest or best, or anywhere in between, self.

It’s not really about a self as a static best or worst, magically unlocked by another’s key. It truly is a commitment right now and in every moment, to give what you have right then, and evolve as you are, from wherever.

Melodryad
Melodryad

I agree with what milleunotte said. It’s about bringing out the best in each other, augmenting strengths and weakness. When I wrote that I was mostly thinking of two specific people, both family members. My sister-in-law is jealous of my relationship, because she married my brother who is undemonstrative and impenetrable to the enth degree. But she is a very critical person. She tells ridiculously harsh ‘jokes’ about her three year old daughter for example. No one with the sensitivity of my husband would date her. Or if they did, it would be a nightmare for both of them. Her… Read more »

Alouetta
Alouetta

I think I didn’t ask my question quite right, because I get all that, but…mmm.. this is hard. I’m trying to get at, how do you learn to recognise what won’t change in a person? Some aspects of our personality are fixed, but we have choices about how to express them, which can make them seem fluid. You said you had an intuitive understanding that your husband was a kind person, a giver, but if he’d been with someone harsher he may have closed off that part of himself. Doesn’t everyone have a good quality inside that can be nurtured?… Read more »

Pi
Pi

I’m just jumping in here.. some of the ways I size up a person’s character (carefully, over time) is things like, How they cope with stress – within themselves and in company How they talk about other people when they are not there How (or whether) they take care of themselves , and I don’t mean this in a shallow fashion, I mean are there life habits that I cannot accept in a romantic relationship (family history &Venus chiron influences this) How do they treat, and or talk about, the vulnerable ( = how would they treat or talk about… Read more »

Pi
Pi

Are they brave. Not necessarily rescuing damsels or whatever, but are they spiritually courageous. Do they have the strength to address their shadows, as a life process.
How do they handle those who hold different worldviews.
Etc…!

Alouetta
Alouetta

Thank you Pi. I think that second last point is key for my situation.

Pi
Pi

It’s tricky because so much of this is age related. I wouldn’t know this at age 25. It’s different, 15ish years later.

Melodryad
Melodryad

I’m sorry to hear your struggles. I completely concur with what Pi said, and would like to add that the right decision of how to handle this type of situation will feel like a relief to you. Relief is a potent intuitive indicator of the right path. Because part of you knows what to do. For example with my sister this past year, I told her politely and directly that I would no longer accept her treatment of me. She said she would change and did kind of grudgingly, for like two weeks. I brought it up again a few… Read more »

Alouetta
Alouetta

Thanks this is what I need. I’ve been feeling lost in a maze full of carnival mirrors. I remember years ago having to put down my terribly sick dog. It was a hard decision but immediately after – the relief and knowing it was the right one. Not that I want to put down my marriage (well not yet) but this will help me make choices.

Melodryad
Melodryad

Thanks Alouetta, glad I could help 🙂

Melodryad
Melodryad

I think everyone can potentially be redeemed, but it is not your responsibility to redeem them. It can be your choice to try, IF you want it to be. They have to be full participants, however. First, does this person really want to change? Or are they invested in defending an illusion of perfection in a flawed self. Can they be objective enough to take direct feedback to heart? Do they care how their actions effect you? Tell them the truth about how you feel as calmly and compassionately as you can and see how they react. Do they make… Read more »

Pi
Pi

Yes, the willingness to meet in the geographic middle of things.
The way you articulate yourself – can I ask about mercury in your chart? it’s sort of a Toro venusian vibe to me. Am a bit curious 🙂

Melodryad
Melodryad

Thanks Pi, no Taurus in my chart except Chiron conjunct Vesta in my 8th. I love Taureans though, so I’m flattered. According to Donna Cunningham’s posts about finding your strongest planet, mine is Mercury. Cancer Mercury conjunct Sun, Mars, and Midheaven, and exact on Sirius. It also has a mutual reception with my Gemini moon conjunct the North Node in the 9th house. In person, many people have guessed that I am a Virgo at first blush. I am a short story writer and poet with a few big credits and several medium-size ones, working on my first novel, an… Read more »

Pi
Pi

Short reply-: thank you! And, cool 🙂

Jokerman
Jokerman

I’d also say he is ‘luckier’ than you.

Melodryad
Melodryad

I like you Powderfinger.

Jokerman
Jokerman

My Cancer / Virgo / Scorpio stuff struggles with compliments…..but thank you.

Melodryad
Melodryad

Ah yes, the warm pricklies (as opposed to the warm fuzzies)..

Triple Air Gem
Triple Air Gem

Wow. When I started reading this I thought, “how in hell does this person get all these suitors to propose?!”

I did not expect the answer to be what it was.

Nicely articulated and eye opening. thank you for sharing

SheRat
SheRat

I have Libra Rising as well and Venus in Pisces = Flirt with old ladies on the bus and telemarketers. I’ve had this problem with proposals as well–never dated someone who didn’t ask me. As an Aqua, I’ve managed to stay friends with most all of my exes, but usually they current girls are wary–I will always be the one that got away. There is a word of caution in here: I do NOT rate people by superficial standards and it has not necessarily done me well. Sometimes, you think you’re being open-minded by dating the depressed dude without a… Read more »

Melodryad
Melodryad

I suspected I would trigger some people with my statement, and I can see that I have. Some things you aren’t noticing in my narrative: -Nine people proposed to me in a short window of time. That meant I walked away from nine relationships, where I either wasn’t treated as well as I want and expect to be, or we were not compatible in other fundamental ways. I am still friends with several of these people. I have Venus square Uranus, and I leave when I can tell something will not work. You can only have one monogamous romantic relationship,… Read more »

Melodryad
Melodryad

You might want to consider looking up the list of cognitive distortions on Wikipedia FYI. A whole slew of them apply to your comment. Good luck.

PlutoMoon
PlutoMoon

Yes, I totally agree with you, healthy boundaries are a must. Being the love you wish to find in the world IS the way, but you also have to be able to have discernment (which comes with a checklist of qualities that you can accept/not accept in a partner) and the ability to say no and mean it. And yes, the frog can turn into the prince, (or even just pretend to be a prince), but he can also turn back into the frog again in the end, no matter how many times you kiss him. It’s also okay to… Read more »

Melodryad
Melodryad

This is actually an object lesson in what I mean by ‘problematically flawed.’ She could have provided the exact same critique without a personal attack on me or my husband. I wrote this because I saw a lot of people on here in pain honestly thought it might help someone, because it is something I struggled with and figured out how to handle. Conflict is inevitable. Difference of opinion is inevitable. How we deal with it is not. It is not necessary to go for the jugular with so little provocation. If someone does this even if they have a… Read more »

SheRat
SheRat

I’m not sure where I personally attacked you or your husband. Sorry if it came across that way. I thought the other side of this coin needed to be heard and I stand by what I said. Certainly there are people with unrealistic and superficial expectations that limit their choices, which is a shame. I was merely pointing out there’s another side to thinking these “bourgeois” expectations like jobs, etc. are unimportant–and that marriage is a crap shoot–people change and you don’t know when or if they are going to. Year 5? Year 10? Year 34? It happens. It takes… Read more »

Pi
Pi

I never knew what a crap shoot was until now. Haha haha xxx

marsbar
marsbar

You prob didn’t mean to come off like this, but this whole post reads as a huge humble-brag. Lots of interesting info though that might be useful so thanks. It also sounds like you may have scored well in the marriage dept but you suck at the friends-dept if you describe them as ungenerous, closed-off, and/or settling for piddly things in their love relationships. But they could actually be how you describe since i haven’t met them, which makes me wonder why are you friends with these people? I have heard some women like to surround themselves with others they… Read more »

Melodryad
Melodryad

I am proud of my life. I created it. It was hard to do. So if that comes across it’s fully intentional. People close off generally because they don’t know how wonderful they are, or they don’t believe it’s possible to connect to others the way they desire. I say the same thing to them that I said here. And it has helped some friends find love. I have been shy, pessimistic, and closed off. There is no shame in it. I never said anyone was ungenerous. Sometimes my friends are attracted to jerks in shiny packages. It is being… Read more »

Melodryad
Melodryad

As an egalitarian communitarian type mindset, I rarely look down on anyone. I see others as equal to myself. I do not see addressing problematic behavior as reducing someone’s inherent worth which is sacrosanct and absolute. I am no better than anyone else, but I strive to better my own experience of existence through unflinching self-examination. That said I am very proud of my life based on where I have come from to where I have gone. My life is much closer to my desires now. Am still working on stuff? Hell yes. I always will be. I can always… Read more »

Starbaies
Starbaies

Love this. Thank you. I long for the day when we can accept and tolerate one other as imperfect human beings, respect one anothers differences and build from there (rather than punish each other for them). A mentor once told me, “love cannot reside where there is judgement”. One day when I find the right balance of reciprocation and genuine love of who I am from another, I will say a BIG YES to that person and the relationship that is offered. Until that point, I am single and there is nothing wrong with that. I actually think men are… Read more »

Melodryad
Melodryad

I would think Venus on the South Node connected to Pluto would make you a powerhouse of love. I could see how that could be intimidating to men not proficient at navigating that depth. Or how an unevolved person could treat it like a bottomless well to draw from. The best way to be single is definitely to fully enjoy it to the hilt, because regardless of what happens you will still have a fantastic life. When I met my husband, I was actually trying to be celibate. I burned all the old love letters and poems I had saved… Read more »

skarab
skarab

Hey Melodryad – I’m enjoying this discourse, not least because our Astro seems a bit similar & I too am in a fab relationship going on 30 yrs now. Reading your description of your husband’s treatment of you made me smile in recognition. I have Libra rising too and my Venus, Vesta and Regulus share the same degree – with Pluto being 2 degrees away. So my love-relationship HAS to be beyond important. And i have been blessed with a beautiful man & relationship… having gone through some duds & marriage proposals as well. Saturn seems to be a big… Read more »

Melodyrad
Melodyrad

Ah, that sounds lovely :). Saturn is exalted in Libra, so a relationship with a heavy Saturn signature is going to be reciprocated fairly. You get back what you put into Saturn. People tend to frame karma as mostly negative, but good karma is just as powerfully returned to you. Saturn rules the culmination of the chart wheel so the rewards that come from mastering its energy are both high and physically tangible, even if they come with a steep learning curve that requires one to face one’s resistance. Our composite chart has 10 oppositions and a mystic rectangle. Oppostions… Read more »

skarab
skarab

Yes, one tends to forget that Saturn also rewards ….(bingo re oppositions in Comp. chart!! 🙂 …this also baffled me)
Thank you so much for your time, M. xx

skarab
skarab

Also realised that you have been the messenger bearing news from Saturn to me (as Mystic has been talking about on the blog recently). And all this on the verge of my 2nd Saturn return. I am forever grateful to you & Mystic & this wonderful community. Much Love to every one! X

Jokerman
Jokerman

Ditto

Starbaies
Starbaies

True, re the vessel of our soul and the other bits of wisdom you share. Like how the Chinese believe in the Cosmic Trinity of Heaven Luck, Earth Luck, and Man Luck. Man is very small compared to the cosmos, but he can affect up to 30% of his own destiny by mere virtue of his character. This has been a big message for me especially during this time of Saturn. To me its apparent why you have what you have, even from the level in which you engage a complete stranger(me) on the web, whom you owe nothing to.… Read more »

Melodryad
Melodryad

Thank you Starbaies, you’re very sweet 🙂

Jokerman
Jokerman

I’m sorry l don’t get being single. I have 1.Moon in the 7th. (Chart Ruler / Bucket Handle) in a TSq with 2.Moon Sq 4th SD Nep. 3.Moon Opp 1st Sun. 4.Asc Tr Nep 5.Moon Opp Uran. I have just discovered a near perfect Yod which amplifies even more Moon stuff; Asc in exact Sextile to Venus with the Moon at the Apex of said Yod. I actually am dying fr a broken heart. Female Q: “What do you do for a job?” Me: “Oh, I’m under investigation for student abuse. I have no income or job.” What about you?… Read more »

Melodryad
Melodryad

My mother tried to lock me up when I was 15 on a false drug charge complete with false witnesses, so I know what it is like to face an unjust accusation. It backfired spectacularly on her though, and I wound up in a much better place because of it in the end. Don’t give up. All of this can change. One, two, three, years from now your life could be completely transformed.

marsbar
marsbar

Ungenerous was my extrapolation of “not willing to give what they want to receive. They expect their partner to be unconditionally loving, successful, faithful, cultured etc. when they are not.” It might not be what you meant. Because surely this behavior spills out outside of romance into friendship and business. or is it more instead you consider these women lazy and not hustling enough to get a man? Still struggling to understand your meaning. So the other “friends” you talked about were more like acquaintances and people you don’t really hang out with anymore? ok makes sense. Everybody has people… Read more »

Melodryad
Melodryad

I don’t think anyone is ever to blame for suffering in any way, because if someone knew exactly how to relieve their suffering and had the resources necessary to do so (internal and external) they would. No one wants to suffer. I ascribe a great deal to the law of attraction, but not victim blaming at all for this reason. And even if we reduced our suffering by half every day, forever, we would never completely eliminate it, because of Zeno’s paradox. LOA is often discussed in distinctly uncompassionate terms, but I think a compassionate position makes more sense for… Read more »

Melodryad
Melodryad

One more thing (I should really be working on my novel). I have been the person in a fuqed up relationship. One of those guys who proposed choked me until I blacked out when I broke up with him. Then he stole all the money I had save to open a gallery/coffee shop, and stalked me for at least the next six years. He is why I’m not on facebook. My best friend warned me, and I knew in my gut he was seriously off, but he was so handsome and cool and into me (way too into me) that… Read more »

Pi
Pi

Hmm, this gives me an idea for a TV show, “The Taming Of The Drew”, or something, or maybe a human version of Treasure Finders or Trash Hunters or something, that show where someone(s) go into people’s sheds or basements etc to find neglected junk, scrub it up and make a motza on the resale because it is in fact a rare or priceless artefact or example of Xx vintage. 😀 ;D

secretly happy that you seemed to understand that sleeping in does not alone make one a lesser life form, or something like that , haha

dark star
dark star

God me too. Having a wolf chronotype doesn’t make you worse or better than anyone else

Giorg
Giorg

LOL “I don’t really see myself as pregnant” … “I don’t really see myself as a mother”… “I don’t really see myself as bisexual”. I am using that line forever!! Too funny! Brilliant.

Cat
Cat

I love this!

Pi
Pi

Perfect.

Redlipstick Virgo
Redlipstick Virgo

Yes this is great! I don’t really see my self as wanting to talk to you now so FUQ odd creepy man

SheRat
SheRat

Is that Cher and Andy Kaufman?

flowerchild
flowerchild

Yes! 🙂

Rubent
Rubent

Ahahah that’s what I was saying! ahaha Mowgli Kaufman with a basketball, courting deadly chersnake

leoliza
leoliza

That man is a liar.. and a bad one at that. I hate that he is hurting ppl and hope karma kicks in soon.

Redlipstick Virgo
Redlipstick Virgo

Too true – that man is one hell of a liar!

MissDee
MissDee

I agree with quadruple Saggo: don’t blame you Venus/Neptune trine. I am sure it’s lovely and I actually wish I had something that nice in my BC.
It’s just that there are some sleazy peeps around.
“I don’t see myself married” my ass.

Porkchop
Porkchop

50% of married people get divorced, and of those that stay together, how many are truly happy? Some will be staying because they are scared to be alone, and some because they don’t want to split assets and have to start over. I don’t know why anyone would want to get married?! How can anyone believe ‘till death do us part’ is realistic in this day and age?! Or desirable?!

Alouetta
Alouetta

I think it’s possible to have a long-term committed relationship (officially married or no) when both people are committed to talking and working things out, even if that means changing the terms of the relationship. It’s just so rare that two people like that come together.

Ale
Ale

Nope, nope, no, fuckity-noppity no. I’m a quintuple Sag with Saturn in my first and oh, this crypto-marriage thing sounds so Sag, and I consider it the shadow side of Sag. “Let’s make a commitment,but only honor the part I enjoy or find useful and ignore the part I dislike or inconvenient.”
Let’s go on a date. No, no, let’s not.

Chrysalis
Chrysalis

*Cap moon grabs the microphone* “I don’t think of myself as married.” What is that, Neptune opposite his sun talking? It’s half-arsed at best. I don’t know what pisses me off more – the fact that he’s lied about being married, or that he’s lazy. Seriously, a lazy Virgo! Sort the details, FFS. A clear, compartmentalised, plausible story in which Saint Virgo of the Golden Balls is somehow performing a massive service to humankind by perpetuating this douchebaggery. (Does it show that I knew a Virgo who wrecked almost a dozen lives in total by behaving in such a way??)… Read more »

nurselilith
nurselilith

ugh. big difference between “I don’t really see myself as married” and “we have an open marriage.” skeez. as an actual married, I think we have to reinvent the patriarchal institution. But being in relationships with other people — marriage, friendships, family, bosses, whatever…that’s how you grow. I don’t get this “we’ll get married but nothing about my life will change” thing. Yes it will. That’s the point. I think it’s delusional control-freaking, fear of the transformation process.

nurselilith
nurselilith

but I’m libra, so probs heavily biased against this aqua “robots make the best spouses” ideal. 🙂

Redlipstick Virgo
Redlipstick Virgo

I am the opposite of crypto married – apparently my partner and I are “LAT” which is the new term for living apart together – loved up, monogamous committed, sharing decisions and planning to grow old together just not merging assets or living together until his teenage kids have left the nest. It’s been 2.5 years of no doubts angst or knowing where we stand and we talk heaps each day and see each other about half the week – perfection!

Pi
Pi

And you don’t have to be woken up by them snoring like a truck… Bliss

kriblack
kriblack

Lol, this sounds great! I always tell my friends if I ever get married, we’ll have to be neighbours or something. Like the idea of a partner, hate the idea of them being underfoot all the time. I need at least 80% of my free time to be alone time.

Alouetta
Alouetta

This is what I want.

Cort
Cort

What about if u live iniddle class leafy suburb aren’t married aren’t gay, n in yr 40s??

Pi
Pi

Then you could probably get a lot more action lol

marsbar
marsbar

No more like negative action if you are a woman. People are like eeewww what’s wrong with you? and avoid you.
Might be different for a man.

Pi
Pi

Well there’s always the “single and ready to homewreck” badge, a bit like the red A applied to the deemed strumpets
For the men, Jane Austen got it right way back when.

milleunanotte
milleunanotte

Read that as a “single and ready to homewreck BANGLE” and started to jewellery audit. Then thought, well, if it were a nice bracelet (big Sag/Piscean hands just hate getting through bangles that fit small wrists).

marsbar
marsbar

I need a shirt that says that. lol!

cortazone
cortazone

Yep been told THAT before by someone whose husband cheated on them at a business conference which strangely I was witness all to aged 10 in Japan. Ihad a great time though

cortazone
cortazone

Aka ur weird for not being married

marsbar
marsbar

it’s not just for not being married: it is specifically directed at women over a certain age (can vary between 25 in some areas or over 30) who DO NOT have children (cos at least those women tried) and who have the “nerve” to show up in public doing fun/normal things and you know…going on with their life. You’d think women like us would drop dead or something?

Laura
Laura

Crypto-Married = People who’ve realized they are locked into a very expensive legal contract with an asshole/boring person/vindictive person and the platinum wedding band has lost its shine. Sometimes they have zero intentions of leaving; sometimes they are hungry ghosts looking for a strong enough vector to pull them out of their ennui and into the land of milk and honey. Basically, if you are gamine enough to break the spell of fear and complacency they are under, they *might* seek a divorce and thus begin the dysfunctional cycle again with you. But don’t bet on it. Most are likely… Read more »

Lux Interior Is My Co-Pilot
Lux Interior Is My Co-Pilot

Is this like gay men having a beard?

It sounds skeezy to me.

I’d test such blokes out with a “call your wife, I’d like to hear her views on it”

Pi
Pi

Exactly.

marsbar
marsbar

Does the beard know they are a beard?

Taurus Vixen
Taurus Vixen

Maybe it is a male Virgo thing to be crypto-married right now. I’ve got one of those too. He refers to it as “the business of the marriage”. I don’t know if it is because I’m Taurus or have old fashion values and morals but married is married even if spouses live in two different cities. Until there are those official and legal divorce papers, one is friggin MARRIED.

milleunanotte
milleunanotte

Good business has clear parameters and clauses for the parties involved. Is it clarified for all those parties in ways that make their basic insurance (sexual, emotional health) pay up? If not “business” = “bulshit” and any one of you can request a simple clarification, and expect it to be forthcoming and clear, in good terms. Otherwise, “good faith” has been forfeited by Virgo’s compromise of other parties’ insurance terms.

Pi
Pi

Moon in Capricorn approves.

Alouetta
Alouetta

I would like us to become more like the Mosuo people of the Yunnan. They have ‘walking marriages’ and a matriarchal society. In all the pictures of the people I’ve seen, the women look really happy. I gather a walking marriage is an arrangement much like serial dating. The guy doesn’t live with you and you just meet up at night for fun times and chatting. Any kids that result are looked after by the woman’s household, while the man’s household looks after other men’s kids. Sounds perfect!!

Aqualady
Aqualady

When I was a kid I thought it would be perfect to live in a commune type situation with women. The men could come around a couple of times a year if women wanted some fun or children but then they’d bugger off somewhere else to actually live.

Alouetta
Alouetta

It makes so much sense.

The Year of the Phoenix
The Year of the Phoenix

I have thought so too, but more like a couple of things a week ; )

Alouetta
Alouetta

Ha!

marsbar
marsbar

So if you live stateside, an amazing resource is the public database on marriages and divorces in your town. Free and easy to look through and confirm! Just type in name if person.

I have turned in names of married men to dating sites who try to say they are single. Such bullshit!

S
S

Dating due diligence. I think that was the lesson from the whole Ashley Madison fiasco.

milleunanotte
milleunanotte

Did they react or respond?

marsbar
marsbar

So this of course was yonks ago…like 2009 -10. Yes, the dating sites cut them off. But because of the anonymity factor, the gross men just made another account with another fake name using the same picture. I kept finding them because they used the same prefs and age range.

Howdyhihi
Howdyhihi

Just spent two years with someone who didn’t think it was a relationship. As an aqua I bought into the crap of “who needs to define stuff”. Nope, just friends with benefits who stayed with each other weekly, didn’t sleep with other people, and did things together with all our assorted children. Then he decided he was in a relationship…with someone else. Obviously, since it “wasn’t a relationship”, he didn’t need to break up with me first, or care about hurt feelings I apparently had no right to have. The psychological fuqwittery of this whole stance defies one post to… Read more »

Pi
Pi

The relationship equivalent of the contractor..
🙁

Xx

Scorp
Scorp

What sign was he – Saggo / Pisces?

UltraSag
UltraSag

Male.

Howdyhihi
Howdyhihi

Aqua.

Leo-Scorp Grrrl
Leo-Scorp Grrrl

Yes. Psychological Fuqwittery. I ended relationship with one who pursued me hard years after a prior break up. I resisted for quite a while. Then things got started, were wonderful. I later read the term “love bombing” and see I was sucked in. We were both making professional changes and putting focus there- so I thought…. I told him goodbye after things got “funny” I knew something was off and confronted him. I gave him an out. He lied but I had no proof. I later put it all together and realized he moved in with someone else! WTF??!? I… Read more »

Jokerman
Jokerman

My Cardinal Sun (1H), Asc, Nodes and Saturn don’t get one word of this. Neither does my 7th Moon. Neither does my Mars Pluto Vesta Venus conjunct. Wtf.

flowerchild
flowerchild

I live in what I think is probably the world epicenter of polyamory and open marriages/relationships. Seriously, on dating sites here if you’re not into non-monogamy of any various type, you’re going to be hard-pressed to find someone who wants a more monogamous relationship or is interested in marriage at all. So, the only thing I find un-cool about your crypto-married guy is that it sounds like his wife doesn’t know he feels that way and doesn’t know about his extra-curricular behavior. Lying by omission and deception are not cool, but if both people in the marriage are on the… Read more »

kriblack
kriblack

I can relate. The more I read about relationships and marriage these days the more relieved I am to settle into spinsterhood. I’m only late 30’s but dating apps and crypto marrieds are minefields that seem unworthy of my time.

If I can’t meet my dream partner at some social function or via a hobby or something then I’m happy to just continue to enjoy my own company, so far I’m my own best dream partner anyway.

Porkchop
Porkchop

I am in my late 30’s and much prefer being single too 🙂

Jacqui
Jacqui

Just watched “me you her” and had lots of social/society/ self expectations that seemed the stumblng blocks. Is thi

Jacqui
Jacqui

Merc Rx….is this a cultural issue eg French may have open relationships, well on SBS they do

skarab
skarab

Well the media and the movies do like to capitalise on this titillating concept. But really most French people aren’t in open relationships at all. What they do have is a more tolerant attitude towards public figures who have affairs or “adventures” – (adultery is such a dirty word). And strictly speaking they aren’t “open” since they have to sneak about and be v discreet – with everyone turning a blind eye.

Aquasunrise
Aquasunrise

Please define crypto marriage? I am betrothed however we were going to amicably part ways while still formalise a shared financial arrangement for reasons of stability, money etc… however our child refused to accept it…and we both knew we had to hang in there so I’m still his lover…though it’s challenging and I’m faithful, I’m sort of mindfully aware it’s not my plan, or ideal…As I’m “partnered” I don’t date anyone or sleep around…yet this year there is someone who is peripheral, who feels more future-authentic, and there is mutual chemistry…but nothing can really happen, as I know how fragile… Read more »

marsbar
marsbar

Crypto-married: people who lie or omit their married status for purpose of deception.

Aquasunrise
Aquasunrise

We do not fulfil the criteria then!

Sometimes I think I’m married to the whole family…

For better or worse.

It’s not for individual gain – it’s really collective bargaining – someone needs to rewrite a more attractive and philosophical premise – of the future ideals of marriage

Aquasunrise
Aquasunrise

The Aquarian south node I suppose in permeating through the north node Leo via 12th of subterranean hidden love hopes…

Pi
Pi

I like the idea of a New Manifesto for Marriage . Especially with AU finally stepping into modernity with its recognition of same sex marriage!

I can see you 12 th house Leo node! You are like a creative priestess. I always loved the way you write about your fashion industry work <3

Pi
Pi

Or a priestess of creativity. The creative principle, permeating our lives in ways unseen. Yes.

Medicatrix
Medicatrix

My ex didn’t really think of himself as in a relationship… Which is why we ended up exes. If we could have had a civilized conversation about it, we probably would have ended up being crypto married and been all the happier for it. I have a handful of patients who don’t really see themselves as married. I asked one why she didn’t just leave… Turns out she didn’t want to give up going to yoga 3 times a week. (As a single mom I was like: goddamn wish I would have thought of that!) From the couple people I… Read more »

Aquasunrise
Aquasunrise

That one person is oblivious and the other is ambivalent is not so unusual, yet it’s the pragmatism of that is morally suspect…I may question my relationship, doubt it though I’ll still speak honestly to the other about my difficulties, and I reckon anyone clueless is possibly choosing to ignore signals…truth and courage on both sides is ideal, decent…

Avista
Avista

Capricorn Sun, Libra Rising, Virgo Moon, Aquarius Venus and Mercury. I honestly don’t get the crypto married idea… I find freedom through stability. My quadruple Pisces husband would get it though, he resisted marriage for ages saying things like ‘But we’re already married. In our hearts’ and ‘A piece of paper doesn’t tell me I’m married!’. He worried about splitting his mortgage with me too. Conversely I realised we will also never get divorced, because he’ll never be bothered to do the paperwork.

BLISS WITCH
BLISS WITCH

There seem to be loads of “swingers” to use a strangely old-fashioned term that keeps coming up- in my strange little rural town. Semi-related.

saturnplutoflux
saturnplutoflux

Lol Yeh I was surprised to find out from some one who knows that swinging is almost mainstream in this city

marsbar
marsbar

Most swingers i know though are right up front with their lifestyle though. I have seen an upsurge in married men pretending to be single though. Most men in the 90’s trying to pull this shit used to at least lie about oh…they are separated or going to be separated. No one cares about pretending to be moral. It’s all about being uncaught and getting away with it.

Lili
Lili

So my BIL lives in a hotel cum pension where a group of his aging, indy cronies moved in and requested handicapped access suites. Many are former antiquers/hustlers/indy business peeps. They have quite the happy community and.., The hotel has a monthly swingers weekend- complete with black-out curtains and wristbands. Rules- no singles- couples only. Near the basement laundry room is a hook-up room- according to BIL’s caregiver who described it in hilarious detail. They require proof of recent STD/HIV tests too. Black out curtains provide privacy for guests as they swan around in alluring get-ups. Security guard yawned as… Read more »

marsbar
marsbar

There are even swinger cruises you can sign up for!

skarab
skarab

Are there an inordinate number of front lawns in your town with pampas grass in them?

Jokerman
Jokerman

Is pampas really a thing? I’ve lived in a few ‘WOW’ towns (way out west) and this is spoken of, as in “see those ppl over there, well…..”

skarab
skarab

I thought it was just a suburban myth until i read this article in The Sun – stalwart of seriousness & truth reporting.
Pineapple knockers are also a sign.

skarab
skarab

Bugger – wrong link! However the above video is also for you as i once heard it on the Bob Dylan Theme Hour radio show. It’s a really creepy song about neighbourly love.

skarab
skarab

this is The Sun link on suburban secret swinging signs:

skarab
skarab
Jokerman
Jokerman

Def creepy song.
And why do ppl go to such bother (white rocks, black rings, gnomes, ppampas)?

marsbar
marsbar

So they can find each other and not be killed or run out in some communities.

Jacqui
Jacqui

Is the gen x version wild lemon grass?

marsbar
marsbar

Huge in my town as well. If you are ever hanging with a gf or 2 and some strange man buys all of you drinks. You could have accidentally landed yourself in one of those swinger meetups. No joke!

leoliza
leoliza

I have a friend in Georgia who told me that if you see a garden gnome statue in the front yard, that couple is swinging and available. LOL (dammit I just bought some cute gnome-y Christmas stuff)

marsbar
marsbar

Lol! You know im gonna go google it.

Chrysalis
Chrysalis

Gnomes?? Really? Take a look at this place. It actually exists, apparently it’s a huge tourist attraction. Maybe it’s not the gnomes that gets them in 🙂

http://gnomesville.com

Jacqui
Jacqui

Damn I have a little gnome holding a bowl that we put coins in for good luck. Does he symbolise visitors are Welcome but need to pay? Think he might dissappear or maybe not

Pi
Pi

Mystic your Pisces allure must have been in effect. Virgo guy would be all neatly compartmentalize-y about it too I bet.

dark star
dark star

Agreed

Pi
Pi

Urgh ok I’m nowhere near married, never have been, Pluto in libra generation, my airy bits say whatever who cares such rrangements are just a formality and you can’t fight chemistry and we all deserve fulfilment, but then the other part of me (earth and water? Saturn?) Says are you fuqing kidding me fuq that, have your cake and eat it too why dontcha, nice to know I’m somewhere around 14th on your priority list cool cat, c ya wouldn’t wanna be ya, enjoy coming home to your wife and material security each day So you see it’s all a… Read more »

Medicatrix
Medicatrix

I don’t understand how anyone with Pluto in Libra stays in a LTR! (As a fellow Pluto in Libra-er).

Pi
Pi

Raised by uranians who weren’t exactly model family, didn’t leave me with a lot of faith in the whole deal when it came to the fine print, lol.

Pi
Pi

Although lately I’ve been realising the ‘shape’ of a 10th house Aries north node (combined with the rest of my astro) – inherently repelled by the sticky messiness of human interrelationship. It’s been an interesting set of energies to examine with a bit more awareness .. that progressed cancerian moon is still working away hahaha

Pi
Pi

Oops I mean Aries *south* node

SheRat
SheRat

I have Pluto Rising in Libra….along with a Moon/Uranus conj. This is opposite Mars (conj. Dionysius!) in Aries 7th (currently being loved by Uranus/Eris/Pallas conj., btw). All my long-terms have been hyper-Plutonic, as is my parents’ marriage. This kinda makes me love really intense LDRs–I like intensity but I need the space. I think my perfect scenario might be a really intense LDR that I see quarterly for two weeks of hyper-romantic bliss and then it’s okay to have one-night stands should they arise. I also think it would be great if the one-night stands could be talked about as… Read more »

Pi
Pi

Ahahaah classic Libra tactics, let the other party think it was their idea, hadn’t thought about it the way you say though 🙂

ICPluto
ICPluto

Interesting, as I have an opposite view of Pluto in Libra generation, but it may be colored by my own Pluto placement (Virgo). I see Pluto in Libra obsessively committed to partnership. I can see Pluto in Sag, for example, leaning towards absolute, non-negotiable freedom, LTR phobic. Other fluid relationship generational placements I would consider would be Uranus in Libra (here today, nah, not really here) or Neptune Scorpio (dissolving boundaries).

SheRat
SheRat

Well, I am an Aqua…and remember–that Uranus is on my moon….with Lillith and Juno as well. I woudn’t take myself as typical with . anything. Except Aqua. LOL.

I

milleunanotte
milleunanotte

It’s all about the honesty, not hiding behind “oh how my real self would hurt my spouse” if you’re unwilling to hurt yourself AND your spouse with a candid front of who you really are, and what you really want.

baristagem
baristagem

I’ve never had any desire to get married. Lots of my friends married in their twenties and I couldn’t think of anything more boring to do with your life. I believe in LTR, I know what that’s like.

We are the generation that finally has a choice whether to get married and/or to have children, it’s a choice that I am grateful for every day!

baristagem
baristagem

Forgot to add I’m also Pluto in Libra Gen

skarab
skarab

Yes i agree with you. Even my v traditional 87 yr old widowed aunt who was married for 52 yrs, told me the other day that she doesn’t understand why any woman in this day and age would want to get married.
She’s a Pluto in Cancer & i’m a Pluto in Virgo.
I don’t think Pluto has much to do with this.

baristagem
baristagem

It probably doesn’t

dark star
dark star

Lol “I don’t rly see myself as married” did he lose his memory in 2015 pre sat nep square?
I could just be salty re: me in that era unknowingly seeing someone who was married (separated but useful info to start with thx). Imo it’s like a cusp, you are either married or not married (with due respect to open marriages, etc)

milleunanotte
milleunanotte

Not seeing yourself as married when you are, is not the same as being polyamorous or in open relationship. For a start, it would be phrased differently.

This guy is OLD. Maybe not in chronology but certainly in old generation casual misogynistic bullshittery. You just know Mystic left him floundering in the tar pit. We’ll be putting him in our engine tanks as fuel pretty soon 🙂

dark star
dark star

Agreed! Speaking for my self i wouldn’t be able to handle a meh lukewarm marriage…evolve it or evaporate, you’ll only create the same patterns with the next person if you don’t address root causes.
Dino fuel is right 😉

marsbar
marsbar

If ever i saw a guy who DESERVED to be ghosted its this one! haha! He’ll complain to his buddies how Millenials ruined dating by causing ghosting or some shite to salve his ego.

dark star
dark star

Xx

virgosun
virgosun

My mother used to refer to marriage as legalised prostitution. Perhaps that’s why I never married.

marsbar
marsbar

My mom says that too, but then If you knew how her marriage was like for, explains a lot. 🙁
She just told me the other day how much she hates cooking and that it is work for servants or slaves.

I am so different from her. I love cooking and cooking for others. I am not married either. Social infertility plus demisexuality keeps that from happening.

milleunanotte
milleunanotte

My mother and ancestor mothers (grand etc) would have more likely referred to the indentured slavery, but because there’s a strong Aries link in them, would never submit or see themselves that way, only use the duty to create their own power. Aries: not indentured sex, as much as fqn housekeeping. Which is why i love and call on them: even on your own there is the slavery to the house routine…get yourself fed and bathed, the clothes washed, the bills sorted, the repairs done… They all were career women, business women, successful at making the dollar (no matter what… Read more »

ScorpintheSky
ScorpintheSky

The great Esther Perel does say its’s the future of marriage. The traumatised children of the divorced generation (ie Gen Y/millennials) will create more fluid arrangements re mating so their offspring will have more emotional/spatial/financial stability. This is of course a very different proposition from leafy suburban wife in question not really being aware her husband “does not see himself as married”. A gentlemen he is not.

Pi
Pi

I’ve often wondered about the pre-revolution French era when you married someone for business reasons & progeny but then just did whatever you want

ScorpintheSky
ScorpintheSky

Sure if you were a male. If you were a female – welcome to the public hanging.

Pi
Pi

Possibly, but I reckon it’s a workable practice for the 21st century though. You’d have to be super up front though. Could be a bit of hard work emotionally.

Rubent
Rubent

I’ve been unashamedly cozied up with the show ‘Jane The Virgin’ for the past week and it is so very much this…plus a whole lot else as it is a modern day soap opera..that knows what it is.

Pi
Pi

i just looked this up. it looks completely …fab?

milleunanotte
milleunanotte

With or without the money backing. You needed a patriarchy (even grudgingly) supporting you. This would be true now, if you were one of those rarefied like Markle, Spencer (and they had no empire of their own beforehand…makes me think back to the Chanel post on Mutables.)

Clavdia C
Clavdia C

This is basically all men with a lot of money. The motto is, happy wife happy life. You send the wife off to Palm Beach and voila.

And I do agree that historically this suited men much better than women! What about the mistresses who became pregnant and got tossed! I’m sure some offspring were somewhat supported but most were not.

Have to say though, it would definitely work for me. None of my women friends with children have any interest in having sex with their husbands. That’s the cold hard truth of it my friends.

dark star
dark star

Love Esther’s recent interviews on her new book about affairs! She is so wise.

milleunanotte
milleunanotte

That was my first question: Does your wife see you as not seeing yourself as married? And if so, was it because you bothered to tell her?

Clavdia C
Clavdia C

This is the million dollar question. If she’s like a lot of women I know she’s actually hoping he’s getting it somewhere else as long as it doesn’t interfere with his responsibilities at home.

Ninanotsosmall
Ninanotsosmall

Yep. This.

Kym
Kym

My grandfather had a very public affair. My grandmother went into depression. But he wouldn’t divorce because all the assets were in her name so protected from his business, but, more particularly, we didn’t yet have no fault divorce laws, so each hearing was something of a public trial. Media – print newspaper- coverage was par for the course There are photos in tne family of grandfather and mistress, out and about on the town. My Mum and her older sister wouldn’t talk about it. Only thing mum would say is that her father’s left hand didn’t know what his… Read more »

sphinx
sphinx

Poor grandma 🙁

bird
bird

That’s so sad.

bulldash
bulldash

Venus trine neptune.. looked it up on a hunch after reading you comment & yep :/

bulldash
bulldash

..venus in pieces

Kala
Kala

it happens with my venus in pisces square neptune too

S
S

Yesterday I had a conversation with a women and she was convinced I was married. It was assumed I was and had children, I have known this women for almost a year. People do like to assume a narrative that fits their perceptions of you.

I do prescribe to the notion that this current astro is really pinging off the societal fabric of morals, virtues and beliefs. This has got me wondering if it’s all this retrograde action, and in particular the true node influence. Hormonal regressions and adjustments seem to be the current flavour.

Medicatrix
Medicatrix

Ha… Projections are so strange. This week I had someone assume I was in my 20s… And another assume I was in my 50s. (Wish that the 20s assumption had happened first… Would have saved me a mini breakdown).

S
S

Bless the interesting Medicatrix.

I just received a contact from a guy I refer to as The Pickle. Let’s just say I won’t be contacting him. Was in fact one Zombie Love Story enough? Oh heck I smell the strange linger.

Thank you book with face messenger for tossing up that sort of moody nautical schizz.

marsbar
marsbar

Haha! I am the opp now. I love being mistaken for my actual age or older. Who wants to be mistaken for a hormonally challenged life-is-confusing 20 something when you have experience and gravitas behind you now? I like looking like my best self via working out and good eating, etc. but i will not bother with crap like dyeing my hair unless it is fun. i am marked by life not beyond my sell-by date just because i don’t look like a nubile co-ed anymore with the application of chemicals and coatings. i jack-hammered that bit of self-hating ingrained… Read more »

milleunanotte
milleunanotte

I’m still trying to remember my theatre training to smile in a lovely way when asked about children, before responding, instead of what still comes out as a horrified and possibly repulsed/bewildered expression.

S
S

I mentioned having worked for a Government department and my nervous breakdown.
She said “40, oh it’s all downhill from there.”

Even had a friend say to me this week “Oh you just can’t handle bullshit.” Fakery has always pissed me off and I just can’t tolerate the ebb and flow of faux conversations.

milleunanotte
milleunanotte

I have never been able to and am theatre training, just to know how to keep the wheels greased and turning so everyone can get on with their day. This will never interfere with my radar. It will be more like a better skill in deflecting the bs from taking my energy from my own good and hard work. Not too grand at it but so far, I am noticing less feeding of the fqerel, and more nodding twinkly eyed compliance. Those people notably handle my sharp side much better now that i’ve learned to “grease the social wheel” Anyone… Read more »

Pi
Pi

hahaha I get this sometimes… i am a bit evil (eris ftw) so I just shrug and say “nope!” smile and move on. some ppl look confused. I think I secretly get a kick out of that. there’s a bit of recalculating and working out what topic to turn to if it’s not progeny. Usually i just skip along to the next interesting thing to talk about 🙂 better in the art world though. Such matters are neither here nor there. we’re there for other reasons
i’m noticing men seem to think, but not ask, the question (wise move fellas).

milleunanotte
milleunanotte

You’ve distinguished it! Used to socialising in the art/music world, and just getting on with it in my work world. Now i’m managing people and therefore being also managed by superiors in a different way, i’ve had to re-calibrate.

In the work world, men wouldn’t even think about asking it; it’s always women, and there’s a lot more social negotiation i’m not used to finessing there. In the social world? Well, that’s my playground: interfere with it at peril 🙂

Pi
Pi

yeah it is a bit wierd sometimes. until i had a job back in normie-land I had actually forgotten what the vibe was. I mean, nothing was bad as such. we’re all just living our lives etc. of course. but it was like i had landed from a parallel universe back in wherever I used to live. there was a a lot of cognitive … re-shuffling.

anpan
anpan

Wait…. Did Christian Bale actually ask you about Saturn and Pluto?!

virgolicious
virgolicious

I’m married to crypto . . . currency.

Cat
Cat

Sounds like a promising yet volatile relationship.

Mystic Medusa
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