Why Am I Doing My Ascendant Not My Sun Sign?

The Black MermaidHey Mystic

I have this astro question which has been bugging me for a while now and i’ve just gotta ask you because…….it’s REALLY BUGGING me. I have heard somewhere around the astro traps that when you are younger you tend to project your ascendent, but as you get older you kinda do the switch and project your sun sign.

Well WTF – I’m Leo Sun with Aquarius rising, and all the action going down for me at the moment (and probably for at least the last 18 months) is totally Aquarian. I read the scopes for both signs, and I feel that I’m more Aquarian than I have ever been before. But I still make sure that my hair is just right mind you……The only explanation that I can think of is courtesy of the awesome Zap Zone. I have been zapping along for some time now, and have been experiencing quantum shifts in my thinking on so many levels that it’s literally mind blowing. The other morning I woke up and felt like my all my synapses were directly wired into the universe – an experience which I have never had in my 47 years on this planet.  While I was grateful for the blessing of having the universe attempt to download its wisdom into my brain, there’s only so much my grey matter I could absorb, so I went and worked in the garden for a couple of hours to ground myself (honoring my Taurus moon).

And if this seems like a plausible explanation, well fuq, fuq, and fuq again as this still has a way to go till 2016, with 4 more direct ‘zaps’ in the pipeline……..and I’m exhausted already!!

Of course, you may have another take on the matter (she asks hopefully).

Confused Leo

PS thank the goddess for your scopes. I feel like I’ve got an inside edge on the craziness.

Dear Confused Leo,

Pull yourself together – confusion does not become Leos.  Well you may think Zap Zone and Uranus IS your chart ruler but this sounds Neptunian to me – that universal one-ness vibe. Are you also alternating between Yin Yoga & Blue Devil Hoochie Juice? Romanticizing people you can’t have but flat-refusing to date those you can have on spiritual dev grounds? Lucid dreaming?

So i think Neptune transit, Ascendant progressed into Pisces and/or maybe you mistakenly watched your linen in essential oil of catnip?

But seriously, i don’t buy that ‘we act like our ascendant early and then do the sun sign’ thing. I mean, there are SO many different aspects of a chart. If you have – for example – Uranus in Scorpio Rising with Mars in Leo square that and on the Midheaven, you know you’re doing that. You’re like a big jungle cat individualistic dakini rocking bit of business.

There is no orderly structure like you do your Ascendant first and then whatever else. The Ascendant is how we are seen, however, and so it’s like a default setting and then the idea is that we have to learn to develop the Sun and so forth. It can be confusing, that’s why it is worth getting your chart done. I try to decode the birth chart in my Astral DNA mp3s and honestly the order in which to do your Asc is the last thing I think of.

I think (and there is an Astro-D.I.Y. post on this that I will link to later) it’s more helpful to look at your top 3 most intense, closest aspects.  What does everyone else think?


Image: Yemanja


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I, too, experience what seems like this Sun vs Ascendant confusion.

So I was hoping someone could enlighten me re how to find the “3 most intense, closest aspects” in my chart? (Mystic suggested these are the things to pay closest attention to).

Apologies if someone’s already asked this. I pulled a classic Aries and skipped through the comments, straight to the “Yeah, but what about ME? 😉


I agree that houses and aspects are really important. I have a toro sun and asc in tight conjunction but these days I don’t feel like much bull. I’m pretty sure I’ve become a closet Leo due to a really inescapable, stellium of personal planets in my first house that trickles into the 12th, hence somewhat muted or ninja cat. Sun and Asc and Venus in 1st house all are square my North Node in Leo so I don’t know what fuqing century I’m in most days….although I fantasize that I’d be a great aristoCAT at a parisian court of… Read more »


OK, I am Leo Sun ( and a bunch more), but Cancer ASC. I mostly tend to look and dress like Cancer (except my hair 🙂 ) , and also tend to behave like one. However, I have noticed that I get myself in trouble ONLY when I forget my Leo-self, when I don’t behave like a cat or a queen. That’s when I get turned into a doormat by being too nice to people, or too agreeable, or otherwise behaving like a Cancer but without the crabby claws that protect them. Maybe if you do your ASC instead of… Read more »


Yea, I don’t know either really. I’m Cap Rising – so Saturn chart ruler. But Sagittarius Rising descriptions fit me so well. Aside from the facial descriptions of cap rising which do fit, along with the dry wit and stuff. But, then I have to take into consideration the fact that I have Saturn in the 9th house – Sagittarius’ house. Saturn is conjunct (by 1deg) Jupiter – Sagiattarius’ ruling planet – in Libra. In addition to this, Saturn SQUARES my Acsencdent – exactly. So does Jupiter. Plus, the closest aspect in my chart is Mercury in Leo in the… Read more »


Love that the Mermaid’s skirt/pants ? are made of fishing net, cool.


This is interesting to me cuz I have a similar issue, but reversed-ish. I have a Cap sun + Leo asc. and tbh I don’t feel very Leo? How much I connect w/ the concept of the asc seems to have a lot to do with where the sun is, for me, in sign and house? If your aqua rising does that mean you’ll have/are having the sun et al; in the fifth? That should be nice for leo-stuff, right? But I have natal sun in the fifth, so maybe it’s just a big deal to me, I’m not even… Read more »


I think since im an aquarius it takes less for a naturally objective sign to see how the ascendant works. The only thing that had me fixed on my sun really was me being a fixed sign. Once i went all objective i so noticed my leo ness. And a few pictures of me looking lionish prideful and regal shal we say really set the stage.. Lol. The interp that really struck me tho was if your ata house party, you will show your sun sign first and only, what u feel comfortable sharing. Even tho people dont know astrology… Read more »


Auto correct: if your at ahouse party you will show your ascendant sign…Ascendant sign only sorry.

aqua lion

So for me: How I am Leo – (it’s in my 6th house) so yes, pride in work (I hate people not taking work seriously!) – I think the fact I do enjoy creativity and art and theatre in all its many forms, and comedy. And I do have a desire to build people up. The leadership thing, I think may be quite buried in me though sadly, unless it is “lead by example” sort of stuff. How I am Aquarius – everyone I think sees me as strange, astrology oriented, somewhat odd nerdy type who is interested in all… Read more »


Well as a aqua let me break your hate to work taboo, some people if you want to take astrology seriously you should know some people will have say gemini or libra ruling the sixth or even aqua- to the average leo they will draw ire. But you are not the one making the universe. So we all need to step back just because one “doesnt work as hard” i really dont know what that means everyone is faced with the same basic set of circumstances everyday. Give em a break dont expect people to be like you… Obama has… Read more »

Electric Eel Libran

What do Lucifer aspects signify in astrology? :3


Lucifer represents destruction, but they mean to go agiants structures of power for your own selfish reasons.. to have no morals or be moraless to want total control and power. to do things to the state or state of people without regard of what will happen to the larger collective. Of course some of the population will have these aspects. If its sitting harmlessly by its self or. Its more of a aspect of the persons psyche. But interacting with the SUN EGO or mars and or saturn.. yea wee probably should be lifiting the viel on this guy already.… Read more »

electric eel libran

i went to go look up that asteroid. I have it conjunct mercury in scorpio 3 degrees. I hope it doesn’t mean anything crappy.


the only way it could mean anything crappy is if its a debilitated mercury and badly aspected. Mercury does not rule your identity like the sun.. just how you think.. Mercury is too much of a non completer to carry out any lucifarian tendencies. Anyway unlike the fixed ridgity of the sun. But if saturn or mars interacts with this, you could play devils advocate with peoples thinking and your own to detrimental effects.


Yes Aqua Leo – I am doing the social consciousness thing – heavily into Permaculture, help with creating school gardens and community gardens, teaching kids about food and where it comes from. My showy Leo side only goes out prowling on rare occasions, and only with those I feel really easy and close too. They know both sides and understand it’s all about fun.


I am also Leo with Aquarius rising. But, totally NOT getting strung out by the Zap Zone. In fact this is the most chilled and pleasant time of my whole life right now, probably, stuff is just coming to me without too much effort….. don’t worry, I appreciate it! For me – Yes – Aquarius is how I am perceived. sadly nobody perceives me as hot sexy capable strong cat woman type person as written about in average astrology column, with fab hair (I instead abide by Mystic’s observation that Leos have Trouble with the Hair, which is why it… Read more »


Sag rising at 29 degrees, Aqua Sun, Prog Sun Aries; I read Capricorn scopes first , then Sag, then Aqua and today they’vei.e. MM’s have all re-launched the dreaded LZ! Oh noes! Ting Foons Chinese ones were good, better late in the day than never. Contentment? Yeah actually, when I think about it. I can be a contented LZ. Gee Mars is dragging the chain now. Taurus irascible much?


I really think I did express my ASC very clearly as a child, I was very confident and up front (Aries) until hormones set in. Now, hard to tell. I find people have very, very strong opinions about who I am without really knowing anything about me, often wrong and frustrating. I’m obviously projecting my Scorpio/Aries Martian energy well but I feel my Libra stellium defines ‘me’ more, most of it is opposite my ASC perhaps that adds confusion. In relationships I attract a lot of nebulous men with hard Neptune aspects, Venus in Pisces etc I wonder if they… Read more »


I love that Charley – thanks!

I’m a Toro in Scoplandia 🙂


*Scorplandia! (sounds like a good name for an astro skit show….)


🙂 it sounds great!
I’m a Cap in Scorplandia.


Having fun imagining all the astro lands. 🙂
Some would be fun to visit but you wouldn’t want to live there. Lol


The United States of Gemini, lol!

(Apologies lovely Gems, I love youse – both of youse 😉 )


Haha ‘Ramzilla in Scorplandia’, sounds like a B movie.


Ramzillastan….nice place to visit but don’t buy property there – too many volcanoes 😉


Said in a Borat accent.


better cut out the “to” and the “too” then 😉


Ha ha ha 🙂


I’d watch that show!


Well my progressed sun and venus are conjunct in Leo. I have to say my hair has been looking fabulous for quite some time now! Progressed Mercury is in Virgo and I have been getting one HD after another in my uni essays – plus am loving the research component. Go figure!



bloody hell. nice work on the uni front. and the hair 🙂


hehehe I have natal Merc in Virgo and mostly got 7’s or HDs at uni way back when (90s). Now I note my progressed Merc is conj natal Merc (did start a course last semester but had to defer and going back in July but totes nailed it and first 3 weeks were kinda a prereq which I passed 100% and don’t have to do again, plus great emails from lecturers totes understanding why I had to defer and no loss of funds etc. And prog Venuswith prog Mars catching up is conj natal Leo Sun – fab hair always… Read more »

Touch the sky

I have a north node in Leo and I think my hair gets better with age!


I don’t know if I am doing my sun sign (Pisces) or Ascendant (Cancer), just trying to navigate my second Saturn Return. Hoping i do better than the first time! 🙂


‘ If you have – for example – Uranus in Scorpio Rising with Mars in Leo square that and on the Midheaven, you know you’re doing *that*.’
I have exactly this – what’s the italic *that* all about ?

random example or pertinent to now ?

also, yes i bought organic celery for the first time in maybe ten years this week


Mystic may correct me here but I think that the italic was not about this specific aspect – and more about a clash of two or more titans who are not stable, or harmonious (necessarily) when squaring or opposing one another at key angles (45, 90, 180) on very important chart points, like Asc, IC (emotional base of chart), MC (zenith or public face of chart) DC (opposition to Ascendant). Point is that this aspect you have natally will ALWAYS be significant, cos it is packs a punch. BUT yes – as an aspect, it has been hit hard recently,… Read more »


many thanks fi, that helps,
of course, not looking to get any freebies – was just struck that this particular set of aspects was mentioned in passing and knew someone would be kind enough to chip in.


I have no way of really assessing relative importance of Sun/Asc vs aspects. My Sun/Asc are the respective focal points of tight, tight Mutable and Fixed T-squares composed of tight stellium conjunctions, square and oppositions. Only my Moon/sappho in aries are not a tight part of those two 1st-4th-10th/Asc-9th-3rd mash-ups. But then I read your post, and I think Sun in 7th? Gawd: how tough. Can’t relate as I have Sun in 1st and nada in 7th. But, seriously, LEO Sun in 7th? Of all the signs, and all the houses, that would just HAVE to be the most confusing… Read more »


Yes, like maybe uranus is getting so much action so it can individuate you


Dear Fi – your words are resonating strongly for me. I am doing relationship stuff big time, as well as gaining deep insight about myself in a way that I have never experienced before. And I’m totally conscious of all the undercurrents and connections, and not ducking any of it, not with myself But I do have to spill to my other…ie this relationship is over for me. What’s holding me back? My 8 year old daughter. In my heart I know what is right, but I just have to dig deep and find the courage to start that very… Read more »


Big hugs to you, confused leo xx Have big Leo sis who has been through all this – the relationship that is not good, the child, the confusion about what is right, etc. I do love the way Leos are capable of sacrifice for their kids but sometimes, if they are too unsure of themselves to leave a relationship that is destructive, they can sacrifice too much, which doesn’t help the child in the long-run. Can you get some counselling? Just for yourself even right now, rather than with partner, to clarify your thoughts? Counselling can also be very helpful… Read more »


Yes – about to enter therapy big time next week. Ready to delve into the depths. Not scared about this, more just wanting to understand better what is driving all of this. My guy is a good, kind person, but I just feel that we are more like good friends. Which is what we were before we went into relationship. What goes around comes around?


Hmmm…a good bloke, and a good friend. If he is also still attractive to you, then I guess the key question is are there dynamics that you feel are repressing you that he is not opening to changing? In spite of my Venus/Neptune (or maybe cos they are square Mars and Saturn, or maybe cos I got into science) the way I see romantic love these days is like this: . Newness + catecholamines + hormones = limerance doing the wild thing for a while. Science says it does not last, for more than a year, or a few, yet… Read more »


Thanks again for your leads Fi. All have some truths. have certainly done limerence more than once. Curious about Tantra, but also leaning towards your last theory as I am also trained as a biological scientist. Also, heterosexual society norms regarding monogamy in relationship keep many peeps on edge. Quite a few gay friends of mine view relationship and sex thrugh a different prism entirely. Not for everyone, but interesting none the less

Miss Leo

If anything this placement, Leo Sun in 7th) feels like there needs to be two of something, like a binary star system. Doesn’t have to necessarily be a partner, but a best friend, some sort of close relationship where both can shine and revolve around each other.

This suddenly clarifies a lot, so thankful for a hugely insightful post (I am also a Leo Sun, Aqua rising, and have not only Sun in 7th, but Venus and Mars as well).


Regarding one’s tightest aspects, should we take into account the minor ones? Include chiron? My 6th house sun needs details 😉


Others may differ but I reckon Chiron matters, big time. It’s very specific about the nature of the wound we carry but can’t heal, where it came from, and so on.
Then again, maybe I am biassed: mine is massively prominent natally – conjunct Jupiter on IC, exactly opp Uranus/Pluto on MC, and square Saggo Sun/Merc. It symbolises a shitload that really happened. Esp once you hit Chiron return.


Totally, my chiron is very prominent and this has always confused me- though it is not my tightest aspect, it is the handle on my chart as a bucket and in a trine/loose grand earth trine in the 11th Taurus trining jupiter, lilith, virgo 3rd and circe capricorn 7th

Chiron matters


Chiron = is a Psychoanalysts cheat sheet.


I’ve always ignored Chiron. Must do some research considering I’m having a Chiron Return! My natal Chiron trines my Sun 0° degrees & Neptune. Can’t get any tighter than that.
I’ve got the exact opposition to Uranus/Pluto too Fi.
Can you tell us what happened during your Chiron return?


So true s.. Lol that is even in a house. Im always afraud to treck thu chiron land with a person im reading for, but i try and make it as painless as poss. I was talking with a sagi friend i ronically my moms boyfriends old girlfriend she wanted me to do her son and his girlfriends chart to see if he would leave her. I didnt read a piece of printed letters all chart. And i told her she will leave him first as she had a venus uranus transit and sure enough she split with him.. But… Read more »


Best I stay scorpionically cryptic on that darl! Given the square to my Sun, I am not doing very well with it right now, I am afraid: my best is simply not enough.

Glad if yours (the return) is not hurting very badly – but if it starts hurting in an overwhelming way, do read this. As usual, Liz Greene distills it all down to something very perceptive:



awww, sorry to hear that Fi.

You have a generous spirit and always giving with your advice. I hope the light finds you soon and it’s returned tenfold!

It’s hard to isolate the Chiron energy with everything else going on. My natal chart has so many squares and oppositions. Nobody is entirely without pain. It’s just the levels and intensity that fluctuate.

Thanks for the link. Liz Greene is awesome. I will definitely read that and see if anything resonates. x


All the best Fi, take care through these challenging times, hope they pass soon! I also have a prominent Chiron, conjunct Asc (which is trine Jupiter,Cancer 4th & Neptune ,Scorp 9th and opp Uranus & Pluto) also 12 degrees off my Chiron return! Thanks for the link, it’s really helpful – always enjoy your wise words and insights. x


I also always enjoy and appreciate your energy and insights Fi and join Scorpbot and F in wishing you well through this transit x


kind words much valued; thanks guys x


I wonder who comes up with these stupid theories, like doing your ascendant first?


people who somehow mistake reading a 2D image of a chart translates literally ?


It always comes someone who comes in thinking there delenating something “new” and astrologically edgy. It just doesnt seem to hold to me. And merc in pisces Always trusts there intuition.

Miss Leo

No idea, I kind of wonder if something was said about progressions and somehow the meaning was distorted via whisper down the lane. It would make more sense, ie. if someone’s sun has moved to another sign and now they’ve adopted some of those qualities, like an Aries learns the calmness and grace of a Taurus over the years.


Yeah I am tres pluto and scorp ascendantt, kataka sun. People see me as a scorpie for sure. I think kataka encourages the superprivate as well. I am not shy though… more selective.


Yeah, things that are way more important are stelliums, where your Pluto/NN/Chiron are, things that are close to your Asc, weird/intense squares/oppositions, what’s above and below the horizon, the ~relationship~ between the moon/rising/sun.


For many years I didn’t do “me” at all but lived very reactively (loaded 11th and 12th). Did lots of music/theatre then protests in high school and college. All my profs would tell me their personal problems. Did 12th NN/ Merc/ Moon 29 Libra- Scorpi /Jup/ASC Neptune/ for the longest- ashram/occult bookstore/ hospital and courts- all menial jobs. Everyone told me their secrets!!Even at the grocery store!Always lived with a pair of cats. Life was one long reaction to family crises. Sick/dying relatives -Chiron is in Aqua in my 3rd square Scorpi ASC and opp Uranus in Leo. My other… Read more »


Kat- I have a stellium in my 11th Virgo and in Scorpio 1st House. In my early years I was very community oriented involved also in music, theatre and protests in high school and college now I am striking out on my own projects with a few collaborators on music, but working alone on art and writing focus atm. Saturn in Scorpio/1st House and a few transits are pulling me away from community/teamwork and towards inward right now. I also have Virgo Pluto but in my 11th House. I am trying to work my 11th House but my current transits… Read more »

Lux Interior is My Co-Pilot

Dang, now I wish I’d got an Astral DNA reading.

She does sound neptunian…even the way the query is written…very free flowing.


Me too Lux – in fact I’m going right to the shop now and booking in. Guess it will be an August birthday present to myself.

Confused Leo
A.k.a Gardengal

Raché (Aqua/Tauri)

Also off-topic: this moon in Capricorn is WEIRD. Like humility and hard work galore, but just kind of really awkward and off. Or is it just me?


Ha -It’s been celeriac soup city here – it just feels right!!
I’m Aqua with Pisces rising.


Baked cauliflower with cheese, breadcrumbs (white veg always kicks my Kataka sun). Up to day two of homemade veggie pizzas. My palms are itchy too.


Celery is good for your bones, how apt that you go ape for it during a Cappy Moon… Yesterday I made a huge pot of soup with an entire bunch of celery instead of just a few stalks (+ used all the leaves in the stock).

cosmic fleece

Celery cravings here too – Just polished off soup made this arvo, Celery (loads of it) , Garlic,Onion, Dutch Carrots – whole with some greenery left on, Vegetable stock and lentils, ..Voila .. Celery does something to the soup..it’s soooo sweet and buttery…Yummo


Home grown celery in the chicken soup tonight. I love cap moons, they make me a bit more competent than usual! Cap rising Pisces sun


Got an impulse colonic and eyebrows threaded today as a reward for finishing a collassal amount of work without adderall (!!! im really getting better) and wore my functional-as-fuq vibrams out for a non running public outing for the first time ever. It was a very Saturn day. lol

catfish moon

I have Saturn conjunct Sun in Kataka…..not a capicorn moon I realize….I love celery too!!!!

Virgo Ellie

I use to crave celery all the time.. I haven’t in a while. But I love it!


Stuff celery!
Have just discovered meaning bought & eaten KALE.
Asked the assistant how to cook it, she said ‘most juice it’ but looked up her how to cook produce book and said ‘like spinach’, so methinks instead, shall lightly fry it with garlic & olive oil, like when it doubt do that.
How delicious is kale, so chewy & sorta sweet, now want it in every meal, will even do a kale pasta sauce.


I’d never heard of kale until I moved to the UK. It’s awesome, I have to live off it for diet reasons and it’s amazing. Eat it how you like, I make everything out of it x


Damn! I thought I was the only one going ape for celery! I crave it quite often……. though I’ve never paid any attention of whether or not the Moon was in Capricorn.

I’ve been talking to myself about celery in the shower (and on the toilet :P) for the last couple of days now…

clear and present

jeez, is this why I’m eating so much celery? lol. I’m serious, haven’t touched it for months but love it.


no it’s not just you. you have described my inner cap-moon life. or something. at least, a lot of the time. developing outward social skills has helped, a little, only took me about 30 years…still going x


i feel weird too. I got a lot of work done but it’s been a tough day

Raché (Aqua/Tauri)

I like that I have the same moon and rising because it feel like I have a coherent and relatively simple picture of the essentials of my character — Aqua sun, Toro moon/rising, chart ruler Venus tightly conjunct Uranus + Saturn. And then almost everything in the 8th or 12th (blanket statement re: that — I am intense, and I’m never not going to be). That being said, my sun IS square moon and ascendant.. So I get the sun opposite ascendant conflict maybe? Do you feel mostly overwhelmed by the unexpected heightened mental activity? Or are you bummed because… Read more »


Dear Aqua/Tauri I do think you have some essence of it – I have always felt the opposition of sun and moon, and deeply. It’s more a feeling of being overwhelmed with the epiphanies. i have been pretty shut down for quite some time, and now I Ihave broken wide open. I am glad of it, and am doing it iwithout the assistance of space dust or blue devil hoochie juice. but it’s very big. i’m fairly new to astrology and trying to grapple with the more complex stuff like oppositions, conjunctions, sextiles etc. but certainly up for it. Many… Read more »


“Well fuq, fuq, and fuq again.” That should be printed on a t-shirt.

Two funny things I heard today.
The words ‘honey badger’ and ‘twitter war.’

Loving Mermaid motifs lately.


aka twit war



“Honey Badger don’t give a sh*t….”

electric eel libran

honey badger = official symbol of Uranus in Aries! 🙂

electric eel libran

agree with mystic! Look at your most prominent aspects when you consider personality. I know they affect me! Look for stelliums and their house placements as well.

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