Can A Love Zombie Be Male?

man and woman dancing in close embrace. It is the Sixties and she is looking over his should at another man

Most of the Love Zombie posts on here feature females. But the Toro Water Snake, at his 2nd Saturn Return, wants to know if men can play too?

Dearest Mystic,

I have to admit, as a male in the last year of his sixth decade, to bucking the trend and being a Male Love Zombie for the past five months.  Your wonderful posts and equally wonderful readers comments have helped me survive this.  I have been weaning her off for the last two months and as she finally got the message she burgled my home as a parting gesture.

 Waking at about 3 am this morning I was wrestling with the notion that I really had no more love for her and asked myself ” Is it right that I pull the love out from under her feet?”   And then I thought  “Hang on, what the hell is my love doing under her feet?”

Ta, that’s all for now,

Toro Water Snake.

Dear Toro Water Snake,

WOW! Good on you for coming clean with this! Welcome! How many other men lurk amongst the Love Zombies (reformed and current) feeling that it is inappropriate to step forward for support.  Here at Love Zombies Anonymous* we welcome all – regardless of gender or age, anything really. 

But hey, you are going through your 2nd Saturn Return!   And it is in Libra, the sign of relationships. That would amplify the experience for sure. Also, this sounds more like you’ve been sleeping with a tricky bit of business and are now coming around to realizing that. 

But five months is a relatively short phase of Love Zombiehood and for 3 am, your thought process seems rational.

Don’t make anyone a priority when you are only an option to them.

The burglary? You have been dating a thief? Or she took something she thought to be rightfully hers?

I will now throw this open to the glorious community (nearly typed coven lol) – thoughts?

*If you don’t know what this is all about, the original Love Zombie post was here. 

Image: Yvette Troispoux

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andromedaBull with sting in tailGemstarGemstarcammy cam Recent comment authors
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fallen angel
fallen angel

This is very late in the game and a bit of a step away from the LZ prescription. Horned – you admit you’re a serial rescuer and I agree with what all the wise peeps afore have written already, i.e. fixing ain’t loving, love you first etc. While women are lauded as being the typical die hard believers of loving someone to rightness, I do think that more men than not, find “rescuing” if you will, a necessary component of attraction to a woman. Which isn’t to criticize, but at least point out the male psyche is geared towards being… Read more »

Horned Serpent
Horned Serpent

Just logged on after half a days drive to spend a bit of time with some of my mob.
Wow FA, that is a lot to think about and a lot worth thinking about so I will sleep on it for a day or so. The sugestion about several friends/potentials has worked for me in the past but I had forgotten. May not be that easy to do in this little town. Might be time to get out of Dodge.

bull with sting in tail
bull with sting in tail

Clever girl FA…. as ever

The fool in a guise of the tempered mind,
With insight as a talisman,
All parties looking for what they find,
But rare are the true Samaritans.

clued up wolf
clued up wolf

god WHO are you? I’m totally crushing on your words.

and yes absolutely I’ve only read a few of these comments but yours FA is gold x

fallen angel
fallen angel

Love the Poet and the Wolf, thanks guys..sometimes the best way to get out of regrettable episode is look beyond what we blame ourselves for. Loneliness is the scourge of our modern age, we get hungry for even a mirage.

But what we’re looking for is not only the uniqueness of the other, but our own through their eyes. I really do feel we need to accept the consequences of our time, and be lucid yet kind to ourselves as we make our way through it.

Ruminate yes, but rebuild, renew – always.

Gemstar
Gemstar

Wow, bull with sting, did you just write that?

What a blessing to read your words.

Bull with sting in tail
Bull with sting in tail

Thanyou for appreciation all,

Would never publish another’s words unattributed.

FA was innsiration for mine

Gemstar
Gemstar

Oh my God, FA, you’ve just given me an insight into my mid twenties. A couple of times, a guy blew me off, although I was sane, self-sufficient, gorgeous inside and out – and instead both times he later chose a crazy bats female that appeared manipulative and nasty. But she demanded actions of him -nag nag- where I just wanted his love. Jeez. Hm, so now that I’m softer and less outwardly perfect – and less yang myself – maybe this tendency of blokes can work in my favour 😉 I admit that I want the chivalry now even… Read more »

andromeda
andromeda

Having thought about this I chatted with my Gem guy about the idea that men need to DO in love to feel in love. He totally agreed! I was a bit surprised (felt even a tad insulted, lol) that he felt this way. Though in truth I have found it self evident to say that we need to learn to speak each other’s languages better. Eg. if a guy wants sex he should connect emotionally first to his partner. If a woman wants a better emotional connection she should connect first sexually to the partner. We are speaking slightly different… Read more »

Seagoat
Seagoat

Once you realize you’re a LZ, you’re not a LZ anymore x

Electric Eel Libran
Electric Eel Libran

I’m gonna have to respectfully disagree here with my share of Neptune and Venus squared. Even if I’m out from under someone’s spell; I’ll find a replacement for it soon. I go from LZ situation to another LZ situation, whether as a LZ myself or the target of a LZ. And if there isn’t one for awhile, I’ll manufacture one.

What’s the good part of being a LZ or having a LZ attached to you you ask? It generates beautiful art, music, and inspiration achieved no other way.

12th house virgo
12th house virgo

Thanks for sharing that. Fellow 12th house Sun here, with 12th house Venus that squares Neptune. I went from one LZ relationship where I totally gave in – sans borders – to the connection. It did end up revitalizing me creatively. Somewhat cruely, imho, there was another LZ connection right after that one. This time, I am much more skeptical, but I have noticed it affects me creatively to try to block ALL that out. Find the balance, keeping the balance is a continual challenge for me. Sounds like for you too. If I don’t put it into an artistic… Read more »

12th house virgo
12th house virgo

That said – I will never go into it sans borders again! It’s was such a brutal experience. But denying my feelings isn’t healthy. And acting on them all isn’t healthy. Fuck all, being a 12th-house-Venus-square-Neptune is hard.

Gemstar
Gemstar

12th house, I love your comment. I am very susceptible to invisible stuff which may be intuition or it may be wishful thinking. No way to tell. So I also discipline myself to only respond to what’s happening in the real world interaction. It’s much better. Keeps my feet on the ground, and I can create things in real life instead of spending so much time in astro land. Also in response to Eel below. I am a successful creative person who does not throw myself into risky romantic situations in order to mine them. You absolutely can be successfully… Read more »

electric eel libran
electric eel libran

i was just thinking optimistically is all. all the beauiful music and art we love was produced by someone elses pain and suffering. there are no free range organically produced music or art or if there is it sucks. and sure its by choice… but just think of that next time you listen to a sad song..see a sad movie..read a sad book… some lz made this. and i do learn something with each new lz epic. the last serious one was that love is not enough. no matter how loving caing and giving you are you cant save some… Read more »

12th house virgo
12th house virgo

I like the thinking “an LZ made this” lol. I was thinking from a different angle. I heard a quote recently, probably on this blog, that when you fall in love you are falling in love with yourself. With my last LZ, I learned so much of what I wanted from him was me. And a lot of my latent potential/talents/strengths were realized from that once I let go of needing him to be myself for me. And, I realized something other than me – bigger than me or him – is real. There’s a huge value to be gained… Read more »

12th house virgo
12th house virgo

To be shorter about it, the LZ is all out to justify their love, in one way or another, often by reforming/changing another person instead of growing themselves. The more they try to prove love, the clearer it becomes that it isn’t loving action – they aren’t proving anything -feelings don’t have proof – and that they – the LZ – must change (or, they stay in denial and go total psycho). Reformed LZ’s don’t deny their feelings or waste time in self judgement. Being able to love a totally fucked up hopeless individual (perhaps) AS THEY ARE is God-like… Read more »

Electric Eel Libran
Electric Eel Libran

wow you make so much sense to me. Very succinct words for me tonight as well. thank you.

12th house virgo
12th house virgo

My God, I’m like a professional LZ. lol!

Electric Eel Libran
Electric Eel Libran

Maybe we should give LZ rankings?

Scorched Earth
Scorched Earth

But a damn good one after reading that 12th.

Being able to love someone flaws and all suggests that a person could/does do that for themselves as well which is in touch with one’s own god source energy. Not a romantic LZ type love at all but hey, life on earth would be totes boring without that as well eh 😉

12th house virgo
12th house virgo

I don’t know. I still hear far away Neptunian types profess their uncontrollable love for me – only not in real life. I just discipline myself to only respond to what’s happening in the objective, real world interaction – (ie, not respond at all cause nothing objective is happening). I feel like I’m cursed to be a love zombie for life and its a condition I have to manage diligently.

virgotigress
virgotigress

Just finished re-reading The Great Gatsby. Jay Gatsby would have to be one of the biggest LZs of all time, surely.

And this is a Great American Novel? I don´t understand.

12th house virgo
12th house virgo

OMG – Gastsby is a TOTAL love zombie. lol. Never critiqued the book from the lz perspective before.

gbs
gbs

LZs make some of the richest territory for great novels. See: Bovary, Emma and Compson, Quentin for starters.

clued up wolf
clued up wolf

i think they’re referring to his encapsulation of the spirit of the era and his writing style which was fresh in its time. I love F Scott F but when I think of great american novels I think of catch 22 & joseph heller.

clued up wolf
clued up wolf

nately was his love zombie

bull with sting in tail
bull with sting in tail

“Love in the time of cholera”, most intense LZ tome of all time

clued up wolf
clued up wolf

i just wikipedia’d it (i know but it’s fast and easy right?) and I just don’t think I could go there. Sounds excruciating, yet strangely familiar. I patiently waited a saturn cycle for someone once – not in a zombie way, just thought, now is not the time, later you will be mine and carried on with my life. And later on he was. We shagged it out of our systems – the pure electric energy that made the room disappear whenever the other was in it. Whole empires could have risen and fallen when we were locking eyes and… Read more »

clued up wolf
clued up wolf

sir walter raleigh i presume?

Jmf
Jmf

Poor man. Maybe you need to get over your MND. Maybe others matter too.

eleneetha
eleneetha

under feet, under a thumb, I have had my love under both! What are you a Libra with some sort of Capricorn thing going on?
you are a Toro water snake, just goes to show us that no sign is above this underness..
Mystic you are my best thing in the morning here in Michigan, I love you.

Quadrupled
Quadrupled

The definition fits for me. No self-respect, going for the crumbs, thinking if you do this or that, there will be a relationship when the other party is using your brain, your time like a farm.

Good for you, the best thing is to keep moving.

Speaking from my experience: She may come back so while you are reclaiming your sincerity and emotions, also work on your boundaries.Bury your fantasies.

The Leo Socialite
The Leo Socialite

YES!!! Crumbs! I don’t have any food supply issues but that idea works for me. When i was a love zombie i used to get a crumb (like a missed call he made to me) and perv over that crumb for days. I was pathetic. When i talk to my daughters now i am like someone who escaped a cult, i give them clear warnings about not being a love zombie. Did he treat me like a farm? I am not so sure of that. Leo. I see myself as a wild and precious beast at all times, Surely nobody… Read more »

Quadrupled
Quadrupled

LOL, thinking a Leo as a LZ is difficult already 🙂 The undeserved time and mental space a LZ gives to the object of obsession was in my mind. I, as an ex LZ, still regret that.

Charles
Charles

I am sure everyone had me identified as a Love Zombie, when they heard of my misadventures with crazy Miss Gemini. But that is all in the distant past. Or so I thought. She just showed up in town last week and was seen hanging around with the homeless guy she sent to stalk me and who served 30 days in jail for punching me in the face. I am going out of my way to avoid that whole scene.

Andromeda
Andromeda

For a mo I thought you were the Horned Serpent Charles!
But you have battle scars to protect you…

bull with sting in tail
bull with sting in tail

Mais non !

:-0

Pegasus
Pegasus

O there you are Charles, (am scrolling down after a night out) and thought it was you playing silly buggers. Till i saw your name.
So glad it isn’t you.

Andromeda
Andromeda

Like that def Scorched E. Love how clever & succinct Mr. Horned Serpent’s letter is. Tread softly on the carpet of another’s love – yes! Love is in the Earth though, but not to be ridden rough-shod over… Stealing is her way of saying she wants your devotion I think (among other things). I think this counts as Zombie territory. A lack of boundaries & a Suspension of disbelief. But it is a story of a journey to self recognition. Maybe us who didn’t feel especially loved as children are vulnerable to this disease? Or who just have Venus in… Read more »

Andromeda
Andromeda

Soz it’s this Moon in Pisces, I am a jumble.

Virgo Ellie
Virgo Ellie

Hi Andromeda… good point about us being children and lacking love leading some of us into LZ world. I also think it maybe in relation to being abandoned when we were younger. Those sensitive ages when we are bonding with a male (or female) and the connection is severed for some reason as children we don’t understand. So, when we find someone that we feel a strong connection to and they don’t respond.. we become LZ’s… just saying.

xo!!

Andromeda
Andromeda

Yes I think you are just sayin’ like it is VE.
It is narcissistic and masturbatory on one hand and innocent pain on the other. Loss of or lack of love leads to neurological poverty in some areas of the brain. When this need gets met at some point is like heroin to the LZ. Really it requires rehab.
Rehab for Love Zombies. “They wanna make me go to rehab, I say No, No, No”. And never have that love again? Poor misguided LZ’s.
Or could be a bit of Karma in the mix too. Just sayin’.

gbs
gbs

Yes, this is some very painful emotional territory. We joke about Love Zombiehood around here, and that humor can be a helpful way to process LZ behaviors, but at the root is the realization that love was withheld, taken away, given to us only very conditionally, most often at an early age by our parents, the people who were our entire world, our entire point of reference at the time.

gbs
gbs

But recognizing this pain and acknowledging its impact on us can truly change us, make us more whole.

As my doctor says, “When you heal yourself, you heal others and you heal the world.”

Ack. I’m really feeling the Sun-Chiron opposition, Pluto-Chiron sextile right now, not to mention the coming Full Moon.

Toro Water Snake
Toro Water Snake

Love this Andromeda. Got Moon in Cancer and Mars in Gemini.
And, to mangle Kahlil Gibran, pain cracks the shell that encloses our understanding.

This should be my last comment on this post other than to say that I love “Horned Serpent”. Far less pedestrian than Toro Water Snake.
Can I, as I emerge from this, be hereto known as Horned Serpent?

andromeda
andromeda

It would be my honour if you adopted the moniker O Horned One. Xx.

(Though if you were Rooster year I would have suggested Cock ‘n’ Bull).

Horned Serpent
Horned Serpent

Lol. xxx

Gemstar
Gemstar

Yes but with that name you may be in danger of turning some people on.

Scorched Earth
Scorched Earth

Cheers Andy 🙂 It’s definitely a mixture of things sure. When someone, let’s say anyone not just a love interest doesn’t dig us the ego will often take that as we are somehow flawed as a first assumption not that the other person has their own stuff or reasons for responding the way they did. Different personalities will respond in different ways to this, eg work harder to win love, play games, seek types that fulfill the illusion of flawed and mirror it back to validate the belief etc so yeah, it’s a personal journey and in as much can’t… Read more »

Scorched Earth
Scorched Earth

Love Zombie seems like an androgynous term to me. It’s nice to hear a male perspective and of course it will be different and/or unique anyway. In my view a LZ will sacrifice boundaries, sense of self and discernment for the notion of love from the one who may be making all the right moves and saying the right things but isn’t really there perhaps even if they are. Or one could be fixated on a particular person and misreading words and actions and projecting desired outcomes. when nothing is on the table to begin with. And still there could… Read more »

1st house venus
1st house venus

this is by far the most interesting, compelling and sensible definition – reflection on love zombism i have come across!

“sacrificing boundaries, sense of self, risking discernment from someone who is saying all the right things/moves yet isn’t really there”.

i think most adult people have done some of this – because we’re taught that to love is to take risks. But it’s when risk-taking becomes a slippery-dip into love zombism…thank god for gravity!

mitra
mitra

This is an excellent point, 1HV. We are taught to take risks in love that in other areas of life would be considered too great. I’d even take it further, as a woman at least, we are judged if we do not take risks in love. We are somehow letting down the side if we take steps that could be implied as a rejection of romantic love or being dismissive of some poor man or otherwise being unfeminine. ‘The side’ is usually coupled people or more broadly, the mythical mainstream society, who want validation of their choice/experience or are otherwise… Read more »

Scorched Earth
Scorched Earth

Thanks 🙂

Guess we all have our moments.

It seems a little simplistic of course and we can’t put everything into a nice little box/definition but I wonder if over complicating the descriptions/reasons etc at times is just another cloak for the LZ to stow away in and keep working undetected ..y’know under the guise of a justification or more aptly here.. a transit 😉

I agree, I think all adults have likely experienced this.

I only thank gravity for some things lol 😉

12th house virgo
12th house virgo

I agree – this should be the official love zombie definition! I know lots of male LZ’s. For example, one guy insisted on riding his bike cross country for his love, a woman who told him please stay home and if you show up I will call the police. I think male LZ’s get called stalkers (most likely, rightly so) and are more likely to face legal action for their LZ behavior than their female counterparts. Just because they don’t seek astro consults or opine about their emotive states as frequently as the female versions do, doesn’t mean they are… Read more »

scorpiorising
scorpiorising

I’d love to know what astro natal traits are more likely to lead to “stalkery: behavior and no means yes to their ears.
MM what astro traits are more likely prone to becoming Love Zombies?
Squares with Neptune and Venus?
I still have a Love Zombie who is determined never to give up. Restraining orders and police did not deter but, angered him and stirred up more energy to stalk.

12th house virgo
12th house virgo

I suspect Saturn may have a role to play in the chart of LZ’s being as Saturn is where we get our lessons on personal borders, etc. I am a recovering LZ with Saturn in Cancer that aspects my Sun, Jupiter, Mercury and Uranus.

As far as the violence of your stalker, I would think that would involve some bad Mars aspects.

Every chart and personality is so complex and nuanced, its hard to pin these things to a pattern. But yes, I do have the love-fatal Venus/Neptune square as well.

cammycam
cammycam

Me too I was LZ and have Saturn opp sun in 4th house adj to IC.

Electric Eel Libran
Electric Eel Libran

I have the LZ disease chronically…born with it.

Venus square Neptune and Moon in Scorpio in the 12th house of self-undoing.

But let me tell you it’s not all crap.
It’s beneficial in that the pain aids artistic endeavours.

mitra
mitra

In some men, the love addiction is more closely linked to sexual domination.

cammycam
cammycam

Hey really true! Love zombie ism symptoms also is a lack of self esteem, lack of personal boundaries, and it is caused by neglect in childhood. I overcame it through 3 years of therapy with an excellent counsellor. This is all from Pia Mellody on Codependancy.

Gemstar
Gemstar

I agree CammyCam, that for some, that lack of getting your needs met in childhood is gonna make you do all sorts of silly things to get love as an adult. But you don’t realise that, you think its fated, they just need more time or blah blah excuse excuse. Its just your lost child, unfortunately with all the strength and powers of an adult. Thank God all that is far behind me and I have a very healthy relationship under my belt to prove it.

scorpiorising
scorpiorising

Love Zombie= entangled, no boundaries, codependent dance.

bull with sting in tail
bull with sting in tail

Time to ‘fess
I have inhabited this mess
Longer than i care to broach
Shared history
of the misery
and all without a coach
Final words
Yet still absurd
When measured by good reason
get some spine
and take back my time
and celebrate this season
Saturn, Pluto
Slap me upside Bruto
Otherwise would be treason
If its only they
Can have their say
Better alone and breezin’

Pegasus
Pegasus

very very clever………you are a mystery.

Recovery love zombo
Recovery love zombo

How does one know one is a live love zombo?
It’s all about them
They are only nice to you when they need something
Yet a love zombie only sees that to make them happy is your life mission.
It is never ending . They are the most un happy people around . Only talk about themselves . Tell you you are boring . But you think they are your so special . It is a sick interaction . I am in recovery .

cammycam
cammycam

One symptom is wanting to leave a guy / girl for ages and you don’t because you are not sure / too scared / don’t want to hurt the ohter persion / but you cant’ wait. Then when they eventually finish it off with you, you are like totally upset and get really upset. I used to do that.

Rachel
Rachel

Weaning her off? Ugh, this is what I hate about dudes and breakups, they don’t just bite the bullet and shoot straight, they treat you worse until you think it’s your idea and leave.

Anony_Aus
Anony_Aus

I think it counts as Love Zombie-ing.

cammycam
cammycam

guys are worse at saying no , in my humble experience

Gemstar
Gemstar

Yeah I hate that about some dudes too. Its rude and pathetic, making you get all this unsettling feeling in your belly but not coming right out and saying “Its not working for me”. I like strong authentic types who are straight up about their level of engagement and their feelings. My last partner was like that, thank God.

Scorched Earth
Scorched Earth

Where the hell is the love.. ah that’s right, under her/his feet!

Yes.. we might just have been gifted with a new catch phrase.

Hard to ignore when put like that!

Hope she stole back the crap you were going to throw out when she finally left anyways.

Go Toro Water Snake!

Toro Water Snake
Toro Water Snake

Thanks SE.

davidl
davidl

Here’s a little tune for our love zombie friends.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUn3_cdxkT0

Pegasus
Pegasus

Just sat though a glorious Thai dinner whilst listening to my biz partner, male, emote, whilst not realising he was, about his new true love and texting her after a glass & half of Shiraz and saying the word ‘should’, that she ‘should’…….whatever and me trying to stop him as it’s referred to as ‘drunk dialling’. Made me want to quote Omar Kyham to him or say fer fuqs sake get a grip you are not reading her. She’s Taurus-your’e Capricorn with Mars on your Sun, speak to my Astrologer, he says ‘no you tell me’, but i say nothing.… Read more »

Savannah
Savannah

There should be a childhood inoculation for this disease. Save everyone a lot of time.

Saturnalien
Saturnalien

Maybe they are both love zombies but he came to his senses two months ago and was trying to let her down gently…

fallen angel
fallen angel

good question.. that sort of stumped me too?

Pegasus
Pegasus

Pull the rug fast Angel. he’s a waste of your precious time.
Thus spake Zaratustra.

Pegasus
Pegasus

AND he’s a submissive so put on your spikes & tights
and make him worship your feet and paint your toe nails.

fallen angel
fallen angel

Haha.. actually this question was echoing Pi’s.. no worries I’m too effing busy taking cancerous chemicals out of plastics to worry right now.. sigh

But feet worshipping.. hmm, I’d have other plans..muwahahaha..

pi
pi

Hang on, I don’t understand. If you were ‘weaning her off’, trying to get a message across, she breaks into your home, you are wondering if it’s right to pull the love from under her feet or whatever, who is the love zombie here?

Anonymous
Anonymous

Exactly Pi. I had to re-read the original post because I thought I had the LZ all wrong. Sounds like SHE’s the LZ. So, once again, no male takers? I have actually known men in a LZ state but they never usually admit to it.

Scorporation, Inc.
Scorporation, Inc.

Me too: I was confused the first time I read it.

Toro Water Snake
Toro Water Snake

She was my first encounter after a particularly torturous year of singledom. We met through her work. She leaned through my car window and asked if I would like to give her money for sex (drug habit to support etc). I gave her the bulk of my income over the next 5 months but refused to take advantage of her plight. Offered her love and respect – just wanted her to feel worthwhile. The relationship was a roller coaster from exhilaration to despair with precious little in between. She stole some of my most treasured possessions but even then I… Read more »

Toro Water Snake
Toro Water Snake

Forgot to say: half my age and that all I was given was broken promises. Biggest problem now is to try not to put back on the weight I’ve lost.

Virgo Ellie
Virgo Ellie

TWS: there isn’t any LZ with the girl.. she is on drugs. That is what makes her appear to be a LZ.. you know that right? Co-dependency for alcoholics / drug addicts is not good for them. You NEED to pull the rug from under their feet (Tuff Love) but know that the consequences can be destructive (robbery / physical attacks etc). You are doing the right thing by letting her go and not looking back. It would be even better if you could get her some help so that you know walking away and leaving her with support can… Read more »

Toro Water Snake
Toro Water Snake

So true and that is what it was like. The long convo with the police sargent (female) was an attempt to have someone on that side with a greater understanding and compassion for the woman and a desire to help her. ( I hate not using her name but that is the way it has to be) . I saw her the other day and she looked helpless.

Toro Water Snake
Toro Water Snake

This is probably not the place to go into details but this woman has had to struggle for her entire life. It is a miracle that she is still striving on any level and has any love at all to give.

Pegasus
Pegasus

Charles is that YOU????
And this is the Gemini crack head???

cammycam
cammycam

This is not a problem for you. Don’t see it as a problem, if you can. It seems to me its a good thing you have lost weight, focus on that.

And try to stop feeling sorry for her at the moment. You need some boundaries, perhaps. She will find help.

Virgo Ellie
Virgo Ellie

PS:, if you think you are a LZ, I disagree. I don’t think you are.

12th house virgo
12th house virgo

Really? I think the whole “love is salvation, neglect my own borders/needs in the process” is very LZ.

cammycam
cammycam

Dont worry about putting weight back on focus on the positive of what you have achieved so far by losing it if that is what you wanted.

I think also feeling sorry for her plight, be careful, of doing that too much. you also need your boundaries at this time, when you are vulnerable. She will get help, certainly.

Pi
Pi

hmm. Yes, lesson in love zombie-ness… You will never ever be able to “rescue” people from themselves or help them feel better. only that person can take themselves there!! until then they blame every other person for their shit. They have built their own mountain of chaos and no normal person (ie if you are not a psychotherapist being paid by the hour) can do much about that. Also remember the kick you yourself might have been getting out of feeling like you were white-knighting your way to true love or True Rebound or whatever it was. I mean very… Read more »

Pi
Pi

nb not a competition about who stayed with the biggest crazy for the longest. i mean that there are bound to be ppl here who know the territory

Scorporation, Inc.
Scorporation, Inc.

Oh yes: I know this territory! I drew countless maps of the landscape during my voyages there. Surreal-scary scenery.

cammycam
cammycam

I know this territory too. My BF was a LZ too. I nominate someone! ( I dont nominate myself only because I am female I was a LZ too and still am a bit but much more aware. LZness is all about boundaries. Love creates boundaries, Love for what you enjoy .

Pi
Pi

oh lord it’s all coming back to me now. my own therapist told me this. when you are involved with someone who is an addict, there are three people in the relationship – you, them, and the addiction. it has a life and a relationship of its own with the other person which you have no access to.

gbs
gbs

Very true. And invariably the relationship with the addiction takes priority over the relationship with the other person.

Toro Water Snake
Toro Water Snake

Thanks Pi, well spotted, I am a recovering serial rescuer. It is like I have nothing to offer unless I am rescuing.

Pi
Pi

ah. yes. very interesting. you sound like you are smart enough to use that as a starting point for further introspection. I mentioned this in another love zombie post but there was a book I read which was one of the more instrumental in helping me be more aware of patterns in my love life. “The White Knight Syndrome”, it’s a small book, a bit pop-psych ish but enough for some serious a-ha moments, for me at least. But you may be doing your own thing, so whatever works best for you. take care. good luck.

Pi
Pi

and ‘intimacy and solitude’ by stephanie dowrick.

both of these books are written for men AND women, in case it seems wierd that a random on a blog is recommending some self-helpy books to a bloke somewhere.

Toro Water Snake
Toro Water Snake

Ta Pi, love Stephanie Dowrick but haven’t read that one. I will definitely chase both of those up.

Pi
Pi

also, sorry to keep spamming your comment, you DO have something to offer other than rescuing. Sort that out bruh. I mean, what happens to that miserable, unhappy person you are rescuing if / when she gets back on her feet, becomes a happy balanced woman making her own way now? Would you be comfortable with that, where would that leave you? food for thought 🙂

Toro Water Snake
Toro Water Snake

The spamming is cool. Good question and I don’t know the answer other than to say I don’t think I would like someone to be miserable and unhappy, let alone for ever.

Scorporation, Inc.
Scorporation, Inc.

Most people don’t want others to be miserable and unhappy, of course. It’s just that, Toro Water Snake, other people’s misery is Not Your Biz so much. You are responsible for *your* happiness and fulfillment– which is plenty, as it’s a life’s worth of work! Nourish & support you 1st, TWS.

PI
PI

oh no i don;t mean you want someone to like, stay unhappy. but if you’re unconsciously taking on a rescuing role, it sounds like that’s a space / dynamic you’re familiar or comfortable with. so we could imagine how we would operate with a partner who is not troubled, nor in trouble, treats us like a normal human, doesn’t invalidate us etc etc. when I put myself in a space where i could imagine being with a man who was not like my exes, it was like going through the looking glass. in some ways.

Toro Water Snake
Toro Water Snake

Brilliant, Pi. Yes I definitely have a pattern going on so I will try that.

cammycam
cammycam

Wow, yeah Pi, that is amaz.

Scorporation, Inc.
Scorporation, Inc.

Testify, sister!

Scorporation, Inc.
Scorporation, Inc.

So right on, Pi, re the trouble with rescuers and rescuing. First, it’s complete fantasy; and second, it’s not love. It’s an attachment issue/codependency/shirking your responsibilities/whatever/etc. but it’s definitely not enriching in the grand scheme of things– like Love is.

Anonymous
Anonymous

*I wanna know what love iisssssss….. I want you to shoowwww meeeeeee*

sorry, child of the 80s here 😀

Scorporation, Inc.
Scorporation, Inc.

haha!

leogroover
leogroover

can i sing along anon and ill bring my ukulele ?

12th house virgo
12th house virgo

I think love can def involve salvation/rescuing and all the other miracles fairy tales are made of. However, when we damage ourselves, neglect our own borders, eat our own brains, so to speak, that isn’t love…love has to be both for ourself and the other.

Scorporation, Inc.
Scorporation, Inc.

Yeah, I agree 12HV re the magic that Love is, the sacrifices it makes second nature– yes. I guess I mean, it’s like the relationship needs to start/be born of Love, not Rescue… uh… gaa

Ugh: I can’t articulate what is going on between my ears today! There is an EPIC astro shift happening at the mo and I can’t hear myself think over the static buzz in the air! Do you hear it??

PI
PI

YES i had zero cognitive functioning today. was blaming it on mega sleep deficit past 3 nights but prefer full moon / neptune excuse 😉

Scorporation, Inc.
Scorporation, Inc.

Yes! And then there’s the whole Scorping biz, too… Major movement! Shifting into Neutral so as not to rip out the transmission!

Pi
Pi

you know, driving analogies ALWAYS make sense to me! 😀

scorpiorising
scorpiorising

both

mrcreosote
mrcreosote

Slowly getting over being ‘Love-Zombified’. Had a serious WTF moment a couple of days ago though. I ‘rescued’ my ex from her then relationship – from what she told me he was seriously wacked. After being with her for a while I had a different perspective, and grudgingly admired him for putting up with her for so long. I have had contact with her 3 times in the past 18 months – each time seemingly like we were going to get back together, only for her to do a complete 180 12 hours later. Anyway, out of the blue, I… Read more »

Anonymous
Anonymous

he’s either a stalker or he wants to reconnect and compare notes:D

scorpiorising
scorpiorising

be careful. Linked.in should be for professional contacts only. Keep the facebook drama away! that’s creepy and inappropriate that he contacted you via that site.

cammycam
cammycam

He’s a love zombie too, sorry to say. I wish him all the best in the world to reform, bless him.

Andromeda
Andromeda

I think he wants to know if he was wrong about her. He too may have been in the throw of Love Zombie-dom.

orderoutofchaos
orderoutofchaos

Chris? Is that you?

Sassy
Sassy

lolololololol

The Leo Socialite
The Leo Socialite

“Chris is that you”? LOL!!! Better watch it toro-snake, looks like someone might be planning to swoop back in and seduce your silver. i knew a male love zombie once – he was CONVINCED that this stripper not only had the hots for him but that they had a connection. He was a screenplay writer and he wrote this (never to be sold) script set in a pole dancing emporium so he could justify his, um, thing. Blew off friends and a lot of connections. Most people who would set foot in a strip-pole dancing whatever place do it on… Read more »

scorpiorising
scorpiorising

Male Love Zombies definitely do exist. No one is spared.

milleunanotte
milleunanotte

Long as it’s not Tony the Fqwit.

Chrysalis
Chrysalis

Gosh yes, I too wondered if it might be Tony 🙂
Love your new avatar, Mille!

Scorched Earth
Scorched Earth

Yeah.. nice avatar Mille!

milleunanotte
milleunanotte

Cheers, you both! I found it ages ago and loved it so much i couldn’t use it straight away – Saturn square Venus @_@

Vee
Vee

Well done Toro Water Snake. Yes, anyone can be afflicted with the dreaded love zombie. Zombie is the perfect analogy for it too because I reckon love zombies eat their OWN brains! When you finally realise it and what’s happened, you can’t help but ask yourself – “What WAS I thinking?!” Therein lies my point. Love zombiedom sucks your brains out! Well done and hope you have a quick recovery!

Shannon
Shannon

I LOVE that priority-option quote. One of my faves.

Anony_Aus
Anony_Aus

Well done. Get your love out from under her feet.